[MaTterJunKie]

I don't know what i did wrong in this game, I did pressure the guy, and still the protoss wins, and he doesnt even micro. I know this sounds like I'm complaining about protoss, (and i am) but i really dont know what else to do. Someone please watch the replay and give me some tips.

Thanks to anyone who helps

[Zanderax]

Analysis yourself before anyone will look at it

Quick Comments

mGGAequitas:

has a point, you should make at least some effort

[Zanderax]

Ok, I looked at the replay (It's a slow night) and I saw one major problem.

You sucked at scouting. Badly. You didn't hold towers for a large portion of the game, you only got your starting scout into his base and because of that you missed many things.

The first was the DT's. They raped you and were the main reason you lost that game. Now if you scouted you would have only seen 3 gates of two bases. That should sound alarm bells in your head and you should be searching for what is going on. Maybe a ninja expand, maybe DTs, maybe bloody carriers, the point is you need to know what is coming if you have any chance of winning

The second was you missed opportunities to attack. When he was on two bases and teching to DTs he was barely making units. You could have used that time to win the game or at least kill his expo.

Yes you played well but unless you scout what your opponent is doing then you lose.

Good luck in the future.

[MaTterJunKie]

Originally Posted by Zanderax

Analysis yourself before anyone will look at it

I did take a look, but i dont see anything critical i did wrong, maybe i missed something big?

[MaTterJunKie]

Originally Posted by Zanderax

Ok, I looked at the replay (It's a slow night) and I saw one major problem.

You sucked at scouting. Badly. You didn't hold towers for a large portion of the game, you only got your starting scout into his base and because of that you missed many things.

The first was the DT's. They raped you and were the main reason you lost that game. Now if you scouted you would have only seen 3 gates of two bases. That should sound alarm bells in your head and you should be searching for what is going on. Maybe a ninja expand, maybe DTs, maybe bloody carriers, the point is you need to know what is coming if you have any chance of winning

The second was you missed opportunities to attack. When he was on two bases and teching to DTs he was barely making units. You could have used that time to win the game or at least kill his expo.

Yes you played well but unless you scout what your opponent is doing then you lose.

Good luck in the future.

Thanks a lot for the reply, that does help me a lot

[mGGAequitas]

hey there,

first of all your opening 2 rax; usually with a 2 rax you get a reactor first and then the tech lab and research consussive shell. Concussion is better than stim that early because as you saw the protoss can have zealots which are pretty hard countered by concussion since they can't reach your army if you stutter step well (which i saw you can do really well). With stim you can run faster than the zealots but only for 15 seconds after that you have to stim again and waste more health. so while you are kiting the zealots you end up getting owned by the stalkers which can shoot you when you stop to shoot the zealots.

next thing is your worker production is pretty erratic you have lots of gaps in your workers (including a 2 minute gap from 6 minutes to 8 minutes).

after your opening aggression you need to get your factory a lot earlier so that you can get medivacs a lot sooner. your next push at 10 minutes(ish) would have worked a lot better if you had a couple of medivacs to heal up your force.

final thing; although you didn't actually lose to dts (you were way behind before they came), when you scout a lot of (unupgraded) zealots and a bunch of stalkers (both units that take little gas) you have to wonder what he is spending all he's gas on, it's ok to just assume dts since the counter (a missile turret in each mineral line) only costs 200 minerals. so you can blindly get the turrets when you see gas-cheap units or you can spend a scan or two to find out what he is spending his gas on, if you can't scout it, get the turrets (two most likely things are voidrays or dts, which are both countered by missile turrets).

+ [tl;dr] +

2 rax opening = rax rax reactor tech concussive
make workers constantly
stim + medivacs = good

Quick Comments

	MooZfY:
	MaTterJunKie:	thanks man, the tips you gave helps :)
	Ruski:	good advice there
	breadfan:

[Criven]

Hey man! good on you for sharing.

You didn't start +1 upgrades until the end of the match. They are very handy vs the shielded Protaws

*Worker macro.
*Upgrades
*Sheild over Stim vs Toss IMO. Makes early game pressure a lot more painful for them

[Bloodmyst]

OK, I watched it and tbh I stopped watching once I saw your opening. There is no point looking at the rest of your game if you are screwing things up from the start.

When you build those 2 raxes, I honestly thought you were going for some super early marine pressure. When I seen the tech lab and reactor go down, this was when I pretty much just closed the replay down. First of all, if you want to execute the 2 rax Pressure, you need to learn the build. Here is it;

10 - Depot
12 - Rax (1)
13 - Gas
15 - OC
15 - Marine
16 - Rax (2)
16 - Reactor on rax (1)
17 - Depot
21 - Tech Lab on Rax (2)
21 - Supply Depot
27 - Concussive Shells

Then there are many follow ups to this such as expoing behind the push, or even transitioning into a 1-1-1 build. Also 2 things when doing this build;

1. After watching many pro replays of this build, it doesn't seem so important to send such an early scout. That game you send your depot scout, I suggest sending a scout out at 13 for larger maps and 14 for smaller maps such as Korhal. This particular build, sometimes I don't even scout at all since I will be pushing so early.

2. When executing this build, if you can deny scouting of the second rax or even in some cases also deny scouting of the reactor on your first rax.... this puts you in great shape. So with your first marine, don't be afraid to be bold with him to kill that probe before he gets up your ramp.

I actually recently uploaded a replay where I did a 2 rax and transitioned into a 1-1-1 build. You may want to check it out as it's exactly the same opener. However, I do transition into a 1-1-1 cutting SCV's when my factory goes up. Instead of doing this you can just expo behind the 2 Rax pressure if you like.

Here is the link to the replay if you would like to check it out;

http://www.sc2sea.com/replays.php?do=viewreplay&id=707

Once you learn the opener, it's a good idea to download replays from pros and study all the different transitions. But until you actually learn the opener, no one can really help you with stuff that is like 10 minutes onwards into the games until you can actually execute the build decently.

PS - God this is shi^^ing me off! how many times do I have to refesh the page and login again to make a post! Grrrrrr!

[Goldie]

i am pretty sure that you get your tech lab first then reactor. So that you have concussive shells vs early zealots.

[MaTterJunKie]

Originally Posted by Bloodmyst

OK, I watched it and tbh I stopped watching once I saw your opening. There is no point looking at the rest of your game if you are screwing things up from the start.

When you build those 2 raxes, I honestly thought you were going for some super early marine pressure. When I seen the tech lab and reactor go down, this was when I pretty much just closed the replay down. First of all, if you want to execute the 2 rax Pressure, you need to learn the build. Here is it;

Thanks for the feed back, but I was going for "my own" version of a 2 rax fe.

http://www.sc2guidereviews.com/2-rax...ild-order.html

[Bloodmyst]

Originally Posted by MaTterJunKie

Thanks for the feed back, but I was going for "my own" version of a 2 rax fe.

http://www.sc2guidereviews.com/2-rax...ild-order.html

I'm not sure if I'm missing something here or if I just don't understand. But is that link meant to be the build you were trying to execute? Because if it is, your gas went down at 13 instead of 14 and you also threw down your second Rax before getting your Orbital Command. So you still were not following the build order.

After comparing both openers I paused the game at 6:10 to see how both your and my builds compared.

You had @ 6:10

- 19 SCV's
- 3 Marauders
- 5 Marines

I have @ 6:10

- 22 SCV's
- 2 Marauders
- 9 Marines

What I also found interesting was;

- You had stim finsihed by 6:44, I'm not sure how effective that was on your push considering you didn't really have it in time for your first engagment. It's also probably debatable wether or not if it was useful to have it that early for your 2nd engagment, I'm not sure we would have seen much of a different outcome if you didn't have it at all.

- I had Concussive researched by 5:50, you had it done by 7:44... I also found that by the time you had this researched, it also didn't really help you when pressuring as you had already lost most of your units. I also had Combat Shields finished by 7:41.

Maybe when doing this opener of yours, you may want to move out when stim is complete? You may be pushing too early. I don't know it just seems a little yukky though considering the units Protoss would have by that time anyway...

Each to their own builds and everything, but would you rather have combat shields + concussive "or" concussive + stim? I don't know, it just seems to me concussive + stim seem to clash with each other when going for this early pressure since you don't have medivacs to heal your bio.

The comparison of builds was more of a curiosity thing for me (if I can ever find a more efficient opener then the 1 I'm currently doing then I'm over the moon lol)... but I'll say it again, you need to go back and look at your opener buddy, refine it down to a point where it's 2nd nature and go from there.

[Fraser]

Another way that helps me improve against a certain race is look at popular build orders and even play as that race and see if there is a time of vulnerability from it. also a huge problem i had in the past was scouting! i used to just do my standard 9 scout (if its a 4 point spawn location) or my 13 scout (if its a 2 point spawn location) and that was it! sacrificing a few lings to see what the opponent is doing is easily worth it!

anyway thanks for your time! ;D

[MaTterJunKie]

@Bloodymyst
Your analysis is interesting, I'll be sure to take it into consideration.
I guess I'll try to clean up my build, with some of yours. We'll see how it goes.

[mGGAequitas]

Originally Posted by Bloodmyst

your gas went down at 13 instead of 14

this is clearly the main reason that you lost. If you put down a building one supply late you should just leave the game because there is no way you can win.