[Next_rim]

Matchup: PvP
Problem: boring 4wg vs 4wg
Solution: Unorthodox cheesy build, with a solid mid game transition

All this time since 1.3.3 came out, people have been experimenting with zealot archons. Ultimately, archons>colossi, because archons kill zealots faster, than colossi, then your zealots kill his stalkers, and finally your stalkers blink into his colossi, and it's a rapefest. It is in fact so with two conditions:
-you need weapon upgrade advantage
-you need 2x archons compared to colossi. e.x. if he has 3 colossi, you need 6 archons.

I decided to polish a build, but instead of conventional transition out of 4wg, I wanted a faster and more fun opening. To add, I hate 4wg.

There is an interesting cheesy-type opening, that a lot of people use - proxy 2-gate. If you 2-gate proxy, your opp has 3 options
-go 2 gate himself (medium),
-continue with core and chrono stalkers, while blocking ramp with pylons (best if orchestrated well),
-go gate-forge, cannon mineral line, and cannon his base (YOU CHIZE? I CHIZE TOOO!)

The only thing is if it fails, you basically lose. I've been responding with 2-gate proxies with option 1 myself, because I feel it's safer. One game on shakuras, i scouted his base and saw nothing. I thought he was proxying, when he actually sneaked his build in the corner of the spawn location. I discovered it only after I got my 4th zealot out. I went - WTF? Oh well. So i charged in with zealots in desperation just to disocver, that his wg research was not yet done. I killed bullion of probes and won right there. I went back to check the replay. His wg timing was almost perfect (8 second delay from normal).

Then I recalled the good old beta times, when people would play pvp with 2 gateway openings. I know the build quiet well, since I beat beta to death back in march of 2010. I started experimenting. Few things I discovered:

-Regardless of spawn location and map size, double gateway zealot rush comes much earlier than any form of 4wg.
-Regardless of his opening, you can still put enormous pressure and throw him off
-2 gateway opening blind counters any cheese, including cannon rush and proxy gate. It is in fact cheesy by itself.
-Can be easily transitioned out of into TC play.

Ok, enough lyrics, let's get straight into the build.

STAGE 1: initial build
-chrono 8th probe (energy will be up when 8th probe is 1/3 done
-10 pylon
-10 gate
-11(12) gate, go scout. Still not sure which is better.
-13 - chrono 1st zealot
-16 - pylon
-16 - chrono 2nd zealot
-22 - build pylon in his base with scouting probe
-24(26) - forge. Keep chronoing zealots
-26 - build 2nd and 3rd pylon in his base
-Start canons in his base.

IMPORTANT things:

-He will scout you and be ready for it. There is no way you can hide this build. However, there is not much he can do to screw you over. The worst thing that can happen - he blocks the ramp and kills your scouting probe. Never allow your probe to die. If he blocks ramp, and your probe is inside, start building stupid amount of pylons. He can't shoot your zealots at wall and deny pylons at the same time with same amount of zealots and stalkers.
-Your probe must survive.
-You will have zealot number advantage
-If he goes 2 gate vs 2 gate, dance around until your cannons are up. Harass probe line. Try to kill probes. Use your own probe to get damage in. Micro like a pro
-If he continues with core, go for gas probes. Ignore the stalker. You will NEVER kill the stalker, unless your opp is bad. You need to kill his gas to reduce future stalker count. However, you need to put a zealot on the stalker just to keep it busy and to prevent it from hunting your probe.
-Build 1st pylon in sneaky location in the dark. Build 1st cannon right next to it. Remember, that 3 stalkers can flank a cannon wall, and take them out one by one.
-Build 2nd pylon behind mineral line to make him pull probes
-Build 3rd pylon next to his production structures to have an option of building cannons there
-MAKE PROBES! Hotkey your nexus and try to not skip probes. You will be most likely floating on minerals some 6 mins into the game, because he will deny cannons over and over, and you only have 2 gateways.
-Make zealots and rally them to his base. Constant zealot reinforcement is essential at dealying his counterpush.



STAGE 2: Counterpush. Chances are, you won't need this. But this is what I worked on in my pvp, since when most good players eventually repel zealot/cannon push, they will immediately counterpush with a stalker ball. However, they have a stupidly delayed robo, expo, low probe count, wg just finished. This build highly depends on the results of your initial push and the amount of damage you've done to his 4wg. Remember - if zealot kills ANYTHING (probe, pylon, stalker) - he is already worth the cost. If zealot stops his stalker push and makes stalkers turn back, he is worth dying. Here, the timings are approximate, because all this highly depends on the situation in his base.

-6:30-7 min mark. You will be floating on minerals. Stop chronoing zealots. Time to build:
-Core
-2x assimilators. Mine gas
-Cannons at your base. Make 3 or 4, and put one in your mineral line. Cannon placement is crucial, since he can just run by with stalkers. Cannons need to cover your ramp and pylons. I'm still working on sim city for this build, so I can't give any fool-proof advice here.
-Get TC. You will have 80-ish energy by this time. Start zealot charge and chrono it like there is no tomorrow. You won't be able to chase stalkers out of your base ever.

Now, usually when you start zealot research, he comes with stalkers. The amount of stalkers depends on how much damage you've done. Usually it is about 5 or 8. You should have about 4-5 zealots and 3-4 cannons. Enough to do damage and start chasing him around in circles. Let your zealots tank the damage, they are worthless till charge is done anyway. Things to know:

-He will have a proxy pylon. There will be reinforcements. He won't have much gas, so after initial stalker wave you will get zealots charging for you mineral line. Remember that cannon? Use it )
-Hold on till zealot charge is done. When it is, you will clear the push easily.
-Prevent gas probe kills. You need that gas advantage!
-Clear the attack and get a good zealot count.

STAGE 3: "I A-MOVED UR ARMY!!!!"

Now, you are in a very interesting position. You are both on 1 base. He has 4 warpgates, you have 2 gateways and chargelots. He is probably panicking and is rushing for robo in fear of DT's. Or is rushing for forge in fear of DT's. Either way, he fears DT's. Best to keep your opp in fear - get DT's!

-Get dark shrine
-add 2 more gateways
-Chrono warpgate research
-Start lvl 1 weapon research (time to make use of that forge)
-Start blink research
-Keep production of zealots up, add 3-4 stalkers as gas allows
-Go build a proxy pylon
-Go scout if he is expanding. If he is, expand too.
-Start building up gas for DT summon
-Starg lvl 2 weapon.

He will most likely get 1-2 observers and scout. It's ok, nothing to be ashamed of.

Move out with your army of zealots and stalkers. Now it is time to figure out his colossus count. Make a ramp poke. Or stay at his natural till he pushes. Fall back (your zealots are faster, your stalkers can blink). Count his colossi, and get 2x DTs+2. Morph into archons. Poke into ramp and look at upgrades. Chances are - he will have 0, or 1:0. If you secure upgrade advantage, go seek his army and engage.

Things to know:

-Most people don't control observer in battle. If observer is flying through a rampaging zealot archon brawl, it will get 2-shot with splash. Remember those 2 DT's? Time to sneak them into the rear and start picking those colossi out.
-You need to have 4 stalkers and 2 archons for each of his colossus
-Number of your zealots - the more, the better.
-Get into a good position to engage. Best to do so in the back of his natural.
-You will clear his zealots VERY fast. Your archons will die to stalkers and colossi soon. Your zealots will charge into stalkers.
-Blink into colossi and snipe them.
-You are left with a fairly even count of stalkers and zealots vs his stalkers and zealots. Except you have 2 dt's, charge and blink, and upgrades. micro and clear his forces.
-WAIT, WHAT? MINERAL EXPIRED? Oh shi~. Come on, you have been on one base all this time. But you have DT, some army, and healthy mental state. He has been thrown off his game. Time to expand, and get a few zealots to clear that proxy pylon.
-Deny his expansion, get mass army, a-move his weakling forces.


I will submit 2 replays later tonight. One is when I was stomped by similar style, one of my games earlier today with this exact build. It is an epic fun build and style, and will enrage your opponents soo bad. I've won about 9 games with this build, in at least 6 opponents were raging "LOLNOOB you can't play this game, you don't know what this game is about".

[Fourby]

Lol thats so funny.. in all the pvp experimenting that i did after the patch, i actually did this build almost exacty.. was quite fun hahah.. didnt quite need stage 2..

nice write up though

[noobinater]

Waiting for the replays, I'm pretty ******* over PvP by this stage.

[inFeZa]

there's no fun way for pvp. thanks for playing

[Next_rim]

Here are the replays.

Game 1 on scrap station - opp went DT into archons against my experimental forge 4wg, and I got stomped. Look how fast archnost pewpew zealots
Game 2 on metalopolis cross resp - demonstration of the build described above.

[TCPLemminks]

Well I've been trying this build out and have been failing somewhat.
Though it's mainly because I lose my probe and don't reinfoce with zealots
Just wondering any idea what the least amount of time you can continue streaming in zealots and still be ok for the counter attack, assuming you lose your probe before you can get cannons down. I find that sometime around 5:30 he will have enough stalkers to repel you.

It sucks cause they always skip a zealot when they see 2 gate, so I feel like I should at least be doing quite a bit of damage.

[ToRDeathsFang]

I've been laddering quite a bit on na recently and my standard build is to open 3 gate robo without any crono on first zealot/stalker but still sending them to the opponents base, with superior micro i can disrupt his sanity and force mistakes. By the time my wp finish i have a proxy and immortal on the way and sometimes i dont even need it. I beat 4 gates with an offensive 3 gate, god these Americans are so stupid.

[crAzerk]

This is a very interesting sounding build and I wish I could watch the replays now but I'm at work

But I think there's one potential flaw in the opening sequence:

However, you need to put a zealot on the stalker just to keep it busy and to prevent it from hunting your probe

I'm no Protoss veteran but if I don't recall wrongly, it takes only 4 shots from a stalker to kill a Probe (or 3? or 5?) Pretty sure if they just right click your probe off the bat, they'll get your probe down long before your Zealot can even break his shields.

It just seems that you may be investing a little too much in the opening harass and if he is cheese-resistant and fends it off well you'll be well behind. I'll have to play it out to be sure though.

[Next_rim]

Crazek,

True, if harass fails, it is a loss. The build revolves around dealing early damage and delaying 4wg push. This is the only way you can resist 4wg with a TC without going 4wg yourself. In fact, I just recently lost a game on metalopolis, because my opp had godlike micro (he responed with 2-gate), and I killed 0 probes and had 0 cannons up.

As for the probe, cannons are kind of secondary. If you do enough damage with just zealots, you might not even need the cannons, can go straight into TC. Cannons are very effective at keeping opp at base for a long time though, so I'm not planning on cutting em out of the build.