[GGenocide]

I'm sure many of you protoss players out there have faced the well known Stephano style build where a zerg gets maxed at 12 minutes and can potentially all in and win the game.

I'm a high player and have been losing to this build quite often recently. I usually take my third at around 10 to 11 minutes when I see my opponent go for a third at 4:30. But most times, when I do this, the zerg player seems to react by just maxing out, denying my third and keeping me on 2 bases.

Is there any sort of immediate counter to this build you could do? One that you don't have to follow from the beginning of the game?

Let me know if you have a solution to this problem. Thanks and GL HF GG(enocide)

[mGGAequitas]

immortal sentry
or just get voidrays and force him to get something else

Quick Comments

	inFeZa:	i don't think VRs are the best choice
	FsDronesInJail:	If you choose to go voidrays, you wont have the core bulk of army you need to defend like the immortal and sentries

[GGenocide]

Originally Posted by Aequitas

immortal sentry
or just get voidrays and force him to get something else

Believe me, I have around 3 immortals when I expand, along with roughly 8 or more sentries, the rest of my army is mainly stalkers and I still get overrun :/

Quick Comments

mGGAequitas:

post a replay.

[Pox]

http://www.sc2sea.com/showthread.php?t=4319

[iM yang]

The most common way to hold max roach/ling is to use sentry/stalker/immortal, taking a third base off 1 robo and 6 gates... have a couple cannons at choke points - use obs to see where he's splitting his army.

If you get overrun, there's a few things that could've gone wrong

1. your build is inefficient and you have too little units (this includes bad macro)
2. your force fields are ineffective and you lose too many units OR you run out of forcefields
3. you didn't split your army properly and you took too much damage in one area

You said you have a great sentry count(8) and 3 immortals, this should be plenty to hold - likely you didn't use your forcefields as effectively as you could've.

Quick Comments

Kepler:

[mGGDaedalus]

A lot of it comes down to hitting your forcefields and splitting your army correctly when defending a 3rd with stalker sentry immortal vs max roach. Also keep in mind that having your simcity wall at the 3rd (gateways with cannons) makes your 3rd a million times stronger against range 4 roaches, so any kind of harass or pressure you can manage to keep the zerg army busy while you set up your sim city at your 3rd helps immensely too.

[GGenocide]

@Yang: I think my problem was No.3 because everything else of mine seems fine. They usually split their army for a flank and I think I keep getting caught off guard. And yes, I have 2 obs out by the time he attacks; one on the path to my third, and the other scouting his bases. I don't mean to brag, but I think my forcefields are pretty good. So I guess it has to be the engagement. Thanks, I'll try focusing on that.

@FaDeJoshboy: The thing is, he hits me minutes after my army moves out to my third and the nexus is planted down. But if he doesn't, I will have 2 cannons and 2 pylons directly next to my nexus all the time.

[water666]

ummm im by no means at your level but have had some experience and am a former protoss player, now first i must say.... voidrays are a no.... if you invest in them and he scouts its.... roaches counter voidrays eg: "oh hes going void rays, time to push him with everything i have" and you die, seen it before stephano even says roaches counter air.

i would imagine immortals, sentries and colossus will be your biggest asset in maintaining a third or if you suspect something like this a 8 gate warp prism with sentry drop to block his ramp and kill tech in his base might be good to implement earlier in the game to delays things.

just my 2 cents, also i beleive TL.net has afew tyhreads solely dedicated to dealing with this, mass roaches are a really harsh build and punishes mistakes easily.

Quick Comments

	mGGAequitas:	3 voids+cannons+stalker/zlot kill roaches fast,
	xGKingdelete:	his 2 cents
	mGGDaedalus:	i see gm players stop it with void rays
	ProAnnn:	i pretty agree with you. Voids are not so good unless you do damage with them early.

[Fourby]

I agree with yang, the immortal sentry build is like 90% about your ff's (during the actual fight, after the splitting and cannon placements etc)

when he attacks you, put sick ff's and cut his army to bits, and ddont forget to warp in at every chance, (dont do this if your army is getting raped and u arent pulling them back and ff'ing before warping in)

Long story short, you just need to be cost efficient as fwuk coz zerg is gay

Quick Comments

	TAEdgE:	your gay
	GGenocide:
	TCPKiaSu:	yeeeeeaaaaahhhhh

[GGenocide]

Thanks guys

[eCKo`Tazerenix]

Or you can just allin with double robo.

Quick Comments

TCPKiaSu:

daz wut I do brohannn

[Pocshi]

I have been using MC's 7 gate all in, sometimes it works, but I think it's cause i'm hitting at a slower timing than mc, and sometimes I get zergling runbys cause i have bad zealot placement

[MatiNO]

Just do Sase's build of 4 immortals all in , you'll win everygame vs Stephano style

[Shieldz]

just good cannon placements and decent ff's dont go to a open place stay beside ur cannons

[inFeZa]

all this roach stuff has made me realise how nice it is to have immortals.

[AxSGRiM]

immortal sentry all in with good ffs baybi

[ProAnnn]

Originally Posted by yaaaang

The most common way to hold max roach/ling is to use sentry/stalker/immortal, taking a third base off 1 robo and 6 gates... have a couple cannons at choke points - use obs to see where he's splitting his army.

If you get overrun, there's a few things that could've gone wrong

1. your build is inefficient and you have too little units (this includes bad macro)
2. your force fields are ineffective and you lose too many units OR you run out of forcefields
3. you didn't split your army properly and you took too much damage in one area

You said you have a great sentry count(8) and 3 immortals, this should be plenty to hold - likely you didn't use your forcefields as effectively as you could've.

To add on to what yang said, maybe you didnt have good enough simcity, walling off parts of the pathway to thirds will minimize the amount of forcefields you need.

[FsDronesInJail]

immortals, good forcefields and well placed cannons help alot
But then again i use this 80% of the time against protoss and I win basically every time :/
The current p v z meta kinda sucks for protoss :P

[Lovebox]

I think what Proann said is pretty important. Walling off with your extra gateways on third. lots of sentries/immortals/zealot/stalker. maybe watch the replays of the matches you lost and see exactly when the zerg player was droning up and see if there's a pattern between players so you can execute some sort of timed push.

[SLCN.Kez]

you'll never know how bad your macro is until youre better and look back and see how bad your macro is. All 3 of yangs points are the problem.