[TCPLemminks]

Recently I've been trying to use Phoenixes in my PvP's and it has been very successful against Robo builds.
The only real hard counter to stargate based builds are DTs, Though I guess a forge and two cannons (one can get taken out by 3 dts) can counter this.

Anyway this being PvP I was wondering if there was any chance that there is a stargate based build that can hold off a 4 gate, similar to how 3 gate fast immortal can hold a 4 gate. If not the only real viable option would be to open 4 gate just in case then transition.

Btw I got the idea for this build from Husky:

You Tube

You Tube

So any thoughts?

[nirvAnA]

dunno who this "alt" kid is that same husky guy cast him doing this build pretty well vs Azz!

You Tube

You Tube

and to answer your question, its really hard, close to impossible to stop a 4 gate timing attack with phoenixes. Maybe it can be a mid game transition but unlikely, its something you have to make good use off at the start to build a high phoenix count. This phoenix build was used when in PvP the meta game was to tech straight into fast colossi off of 1 gate and no one really 4 gated hard at that time. So yea in that scenario it will definitely do decent vs that build.

[Next_rim]

Stargate is counter to fast robo, e.x. if he goes gate-robo-gate-gate to get fast immortal, you then go gate-stargate-gate-gate, and use graviton to lift his immortals and some stalkers. Phoenix is cheaper, and completely disables an immortal. Stargate is no way a counter to 4wg. Better go gate-robo-gate-gate in that case, since immortal is much better vs 4wg.

[HDPhoenix]

So what I hear is 4Gate > Robo > Stargate > 4Gate. Seems like a great design, thou I don't know the intricacy of PvP. I think the actual problem is how to get the initial scouting on what path they are going for, right?

[ProAnnn]

Originally Posted by HDPhoenix

So what I hear is 4Gate > Robo > Stargate > 4Gate. Seems like a great design, thou I don't know the intricacy of PvP. I think the actual problem is how to get the initial scouting on what path they are going for, right?

Yeah, this is the current metagame. Except for the fact that maps like taldarim altar where 4 gate > anything else on earth cept 4 gate

[Next_rim]

More like:

4gate>stargate
4gate>robo
4gate~DT
4gate~2gate zealot
stargate>robo>DT>2gate zealot>stargate

[TCPLemminks]

I guess my main gripe with PvP is that, even though Blizzard made it easier to defend a 4 gate (i.e. the decreased sentry train time which should allow you to get 2 sentries out before warp gate is done instead of 1), but the build doesn't allow you to be very flexible. Therefore I cannot incorporate the use of Phoenixes as smoothly as I would have liked, considering the resources spent on Robo and Immortals.

Of course you could do Next_Rim's build of Proxy 2 gate + forge into chargelots and archons.

[Next_rim]

Of course you could do Next_Rim's build of Proxy 2 gate + forge into chargelots and archons.

Skip the proxy part, otherwise you got it right ) No need to proxy, if you go forge.