[Makra]

Bahaha, future 4gaters, I like it!

Thanks for that. I'll mostly just use it for team games

[PapaBigBelly]

I dont want to say that BLizzard should nerf protoss, but Blizzard should buff Zerg

Enough nerfing honestly, just make ZERG STRONGAARR

[ToRSpartaz]

Originally Posted by ArousalPerMinute

I dont want to say that BLizzard should nerf protoss, but Blizzard should buff Zerg

Enough nerfing honestly, just make ZERG STRONGAARR

Lol that is so imba xD Zerg are actually pretty effective against Protoss and same with Terran

[UncleTom]

Originally Posted by Spartaz

Lol that is so imba xD Zerg are actually pretty effective against Protoss and same with Terran

Can you please no just make bland ignorant statements and give reasons why you think something is "imba" or overpowered. The general discussion doesn't get any where unless you structure your posts better with the correct information.

[SGak]

Originally Posted by Spartaz

Lol fourgating is quite annoying in PvP becomes a micro fest -.- which is such a boooooooore!!!

Play in the bronze league......every toss goes for fast void rays.

[cruxis]

Or carriers/mothership. I love those free win games.

[ToRSpartaz]

Originally Posted by UncleTom

Can you please no just make bland ignorant statements and give reasons why you think something is "imba" or overpowered. The general discussion doesn't get any where unless you structure your posts better with the correct information.

Tom please shut up and quit Trolling I was just saying from the fact that dude wants Toss to be totally nerfed so imba xD

[BubbleT]

Originally Posted by ArousalPerMinute

Things i hate about 4 gate

1. you can hide the gates anywhere on the map
2. if you keep continuing the 4 gate, the zerg player will eventually run out of larva and lose
3. pylons can be hidden everywhere! especially on the new maps with so much smoke vents, and WIDE naturals.
4. protoss is NOT behind after 4 gating
5. They can expand after 4 gating

conclusion: Protoss is IMBA not terran.
p.s. protoss can get a deathball on 2 base with voids and collosi which can kill a 5 base 300/200 zerg army. plus warp in time only takes a few seconds to warp in another wave of army. zergs have to spawn larva, and make units from hatcheries, not pylons which can be built anywhere!

1. There's not much advantage to this. They can't hide the core and you can expect a 4 gate based just on workers, early units and chrono use.
2. You really can't 4 gate forever if the zerg defends appropriately. Plenty of pros recommend using speedlings to defend it and they're the most larvae intensive unit you could possibly use.
3. Wide naturals are an issue because they make spines a lot worse. Use speedlings to patrol a reasonable area around you base, if they have to make the pylon far away in a weird spot then you're halfway to beating the 4gate anyway.
4. If you stop the rush without losing your hatch/drones then yes, they actually are behind.
5. So drone up and expand yourself. You're safe for a while after a failed 4 gate.

[ToRSpartaz]

I was curious guys whats the smartest move to do after a 4gate fails? Cause its happened quite frequently with me recently and I was just wondering, like the comon thing for me is transitioning but it seems I over commit a bit =/

[Crankenstein]

6gate off of 2 bases and do it all over again lolololol.

Seriously though... I saw a nice replay the other day where P transitioned from 4 gate into a Tyler-esque double forge build. I'll see if I can find it again.

[BubbleT]

Originally Posted by Spartaz

I was curious guys whats the smartest move to do after a 4gate fails? Cause its happened quite frequently with me recently and I was just wondering, like the comon thing for me is transitioning but it seems I over commit a bit =/

Depends on the matchup to start with, but also how long you tried to 4 gate and what you/your opponent lost before you gave up.

Also depends on how all-in your 4 gate was (1 gas 20 probes failing is a lot worse than 2 gas 25 probes).

It's usually best to post some replays when you have a question that's kind of vague like this

[YJY]

Sure you can 4g, but the only reason why i have a high win ratio is because Irarely cheesed. Sure you can 4g, but at what opportunity cost? you trade your potential future skill for a few ladder points. All the players that use to 4 gate or cheese are shit now, i.e 90% of all protoss. Nice work in getting ladder points

[ToRSpartaz]

Thats a good point, I guess if you 4g too much you kinda just keep focused on 4gating im gunna try and go for mixed up builds.

[StitcH]

in PvP, I almost always get 10 gate zealot rush or 4 gate.

[NvPinder]

Originally Posted by YJY

Sure you can 4g, but the only reason why i have a high win ratio is because Irarely cheesed. Sure you can 4g, but at what opportunity cost? you trade your potential future skill for a few ladder points. All the players that use to 4 gate or cheese are shit now, i.e 90% of all protoss. Nice work in getting ladder points

Whilst i'm a big fan of this line of thinking (especially in practice), you still literally need to throw in all-in builds as every race or else your opponent is way too safe to play greedy against you.

Good example would be as protoss if you're playing vs a protoss, by never 4 gating and only doing defensive builds like 3 gate robo, you leave your opponent open to do things 1 gate robo, which is has a huge advantage over 3 gate robo.

So basically, solid > cheesy > greedy > solid is the obvious rock paper scissors thing going on here.

Yoon obviously already knows this, but just throwing this out there that it is important, mainly vs someone you've already hit on the ladder a few times and played macro style previously or you're playing a bo3/5 against, you need to not allow your opponent to be too greedy if your preferred style is macro style, cos if they're even just close to your level, you'll lose.

[BubbleT]

You also definitely need to know how to 4-gate in PvP since it still pretty much defines the matchup. It's worth spending some time learning to do it yourself.

[dennistoo]

sorry, the latest thread is 3G RUSH.. look at how MC > TSL

[ToRSpartaz]

3 stalker push is actually a pretty mean build in PvP was learning it yesterday