[Apth]

Originally Posted by breadfan

And when ISPs block those IPs also?

I'm done explaining. Go read how DNS works.

Originally Posted by breadfan

How long is temporary? What's in the bill doesn't really matter here -

I wasn't referring to duration.

Temporary - DNS Block.
Permanent - Remove files from web server.

Web hosting providers won't remove content from their servers under SOPA pressure; there's a reason it hasn't been specifically suggested as a censorship tool.

I'm going to reiterate my point:

• SOPA is bad, however
• SOPA uses DNS Blocking, and DNS Blocking doesn't work, thus
• Effects of SOPA aren't going to be as bad as they're being made out to be

That's all from me.

[Bugalugs McScruffin]

Originally Posted by Apth

I'm going to reiterate my point:

• SOPA is bad, however
• SOPA uses DNS Blocking, and DNS Blocking doesn't work, thus
• Effects of SOPA aren't going to be as bad as they're being made out to be

That's all from me.

Just curious. Other than people like us who care about the online services we use and are tech-savvy enough to deal with IP addresses, how many people do you think are going to just go nope and find somewhere else to go for their business? Bookmarks go to URLs not IPs, and if you don't get the IP before the DNS is blocked, how are you going to get it?

[Apth]

Originally Posted by Bugalugs McScruffin

Just curious. Other than people like us who care about the online services we use and are tech-savvy enough to deal with IP addresses, how many people do you think are going to just go nope and find somewhere else to go for their business? Bookmarks go to URLs not IPs, and if you don't get the IP before the DNS is blocked, how are you going to get it?

Despite recognising I'm being overly argumentative, I'll reply to Bugs because he's baller;

For non-tech savvy people, yeah, it's a problem. My response to that would be that us nerdy folk need to be proactive about taking care of our less knowledgeable peers.

For all you nerds who really don't like SOPA - set up a DNS server in your living room, walk your family and friends through how to connect to it, and manually add A Record entries for websites that get blocked.

In regards to the IP thing - easiest thing to do would be to have a website where people can add the IP addresses of their websites if they've been blocked. Easier still would be to have a static list of IP's for popular sites.

In my opinion, SOPA will go through. The influence possessed by the major corporations that are backing this is immense. We should start preparing for a post-SOPA internet. Me and my flatmate just spent ~$500 upgrading the hardware on our flat server, installing a second NIC, and have a ticket sitting with our ISP to address our connection speed.

We're nerds. SOPA will be another speed bump on our way to domination of the planet, but that's all it will be.

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by Apth

I'm done explaining. Go read how DNS works.

I thought I knew how it works, but clearly you are a CCIE and have intimate knowledge of SOPAs methods, so I yield to your perfect knowledge.

Originally Posted by Apth

Web hosting providers won't remove content from their servers under SOPA pressure; there's a reason it hasn't been specifically suggested as a censorship tool.

Lucky we have someone that knows what all businesses of a certain type everywhere will do in the face of govt policy. Remind me to get stock advice from you.

[Maynarde]

Originally Posted by breadfan

I thought I knew how it works, but clearly you are a CCIE and have intimate knowledge of SOPAs methods, so I yield to your perfect knowledge.

Lucky we have someone that knows what all businesses of a certain type everywhere will do in the face of govt policy. Remind me to get stock advice from you.

This isn't constructive, this is heading toward flame war territory. Something we may or may not be able to do after SOPA Stay on track please.

Quick Comments

breadfan:

acknowledged

[Bugalugs McScruffin]

Originally Posted by Apth

Despite recognising I'm being overly argumentative, I'll reply to Bugs because he's baller;

Thanks.

Originally Posted by Apth

For all you nerds who really don't like SOPA - set up a DNS server in your living room, walk your family and friends through how to connect to it, and manually add A Record entries for websites that get blocked.

In regards to the IP thing - easiest thing to do would be to have a website where people can add the IP addresses of their websites if they've been blocked. Easier still would be to have a static list of IP's for popular sites.

So you're saying that I need to manually add DNS records for every website I, or anyone I know, wants to visit if they get blocked on a server that I run? This seems like overkill.

As for the IP thing... yeah, that is the easiest solution, and then that site will get hit by SOPA and a new site will spring up and that one will get hit by SOPA etc. etc.

I would rather fight SOPA now than have to deal with the ramifications after the fact. I don't want to have to run a DNS server in my living room, that's what my ISP is for.

Originally Posted by Apth

In my opinion, SOPA will go through. The influence possessed by the major corporations that are backing this is immense. We should start preparing for a post-SOPA internet. Me and my flatmate just spent ~$500 upgrading the hardware on our flat server, installing a second NIC, and have a ticket sitting with our ISP to address our connection speed.

We're nerds. SOPA will be another speed bump on our way to domination of the planet, but that's all it will be.

I don't have $500 to spend setting this stuff up. I'm still waiting on enough money to get a new desktop to replace my ailing 5-year-old PC.

Like I said, it shouldn't be up to us to hold up the integrity of the Internet after a bill like this passes. It should be up to us to make enough noise before hand that the legislators realise how bad an idea this really it.

Quick Comments

	Highlander:	Democracy FTW.
	EXCL:	agreed!

[QEDFridge]

Originally Posted by Bugalugs McScruffin

how many people do you think are going to just go nope and find somewhere else to go for their business? Bookmarks go to URLs not IPs, and if you don't get the IP before the DNS is blocked, how are you going to get it?

Hey bugs,

While I agree SOPA should not get off the ground (and It wont), there is already a multitude of apps and browser extensions out to bypass the DNS blocking.

It will be simply a matter of switching browser, should SOPA be deployed fully (for the weird people that still use IE :S).

[Bugalugs McScruffin]

Originally Posted by QEDFridge

Hey bugs,

While I agree SOPA should not get off the ground (and It wont), there is already a multitude of apps and browser extensions out to bypass the DNS blocking.

It will be simply a matter of switching browser, should SOPA be deployed fully (for the weird people that still use IE :S).

That's not my issue. I realise that it is possible to deal with these measures. There are two things I'm worried about. First it is those websites that will just shut down because it is easier than fighting the government. Second this will effect everyone, not just us. We will be able to find the tools we need to get around these measures. The majority of the internet's users either will not know how or will not be bothered doing so.

[Rage]

The problem is that the people who make the laws, in general, are not the demographic who is most familiar with and most frequently uses the Internet.

This inevitably will cause, and has caused, problems.

[Rage]

As a side issue, because those making the laws don't seem to fully grasp the nature of the Internet, they also don't seem to understand that censorship is a futile effort. Those who want to access censored content are likely to have the tools and knowledge to make it happen. Those who do not have the tools and knowhow are likely those who never wanted to access the content to begin with, and the only possible consequence for them is accidental censorship of legitimate content that they wish to visit.

Quick Comments

ToRSpartaz:

I dun like them :D

[QEDFridge]

And accidental censorship is an inevitability

[Rage]

Originally Posted by QEDFridge

And accidental censorship is an inevitability

It already happened during the big internet filter debacle of 2009/2010, when they released the preliminary list of blocked websites and a major dental surgery was listed on it.

[nirvAnA]

I was about to move sc2sea from godaddy to namecheap when they were about to support the SOPA rule. Once tons of sites started to boycott them, then reversed their position and decided not to adopt SOPA. Let me know if I still have to do anything! Basically have a 5 year plan with godaddy now lol.

Quick Comments

	Highlander:	Tell GoDaddy that's why you didn't leave? :P
	QEDFridge:	I would still leave personally. They might have said they no longer support it but they helped write it.

[Highlander]

It's not as easy as educating our peers.

When you make it harder for the general public, the cost is profitability.

Profitability goes down, or even just remains at risk means that investment is hampered.

This may not kill the internet overnight, but it diminishes it for all.

My big question is: What to do about it?

Anyone seen any credible petitions on the subject?

What about something overseas based for foreigners?

For me, as an Australian, I'd be particularly keen to see anything petitionwise targeted at KRudd / broader executive about expressing our view.

[QEDFridge]

Originally Posted by Rage

It already happened during the big internet filter debacle of 2009/2010, when they released the preliminary list of blocked websites and a major dental surgery was listed on it.

Yep, and what happened to that? its nothing but wasted tax money now.

[Rage]

Originally Posted by QEDFridge

Yep, and what happened to that? its nothing but wasted tax money now.

The whole idea of internet censorship is nothing more than wasted tax money. It won't achieve its goal of censoring the internet, all it will do is inconvenience those who have no intentions of doing any wrong.

[Rage]

Those who want to access censored websites will be able to do so regardless of any censorship measures. The rest of us never wanted to access those websites anyway, and may also find innocent websites accidentally blacklisted.

[QEDFridge]

Originally Posted by Rage

Those who want to access censored websites will be able to do so regardless of any censorship measures. The rest of us never wanted to access those websites anyway, and may also find innocent websites accidentally blacklisted.

exactly. Its ridiculous.

Quick Comments

ToRSpartaz:

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE. I agree ^^

[MazEi]

I didn't read all of the thread but Apth, just wanna address this point. While it is simple to us nerds to work around the DNS blacklisting, what about the general public who uses Internet Explorer and the only games they play are Facebook games? I don't think they would even begin to understand what a DNS is, let alone trying to learn the work around(properly. They could just learn the method without understanding a single thing I guess).

If this bill passes, yeah, we still can go to sites which are blacklisted, but what about everyone else?

And do take in mind I didn't read much of the thread so this point may have been said upon many times.

[TAminimat]

Can I still watch porn??