[TAavanar]

Originally Posted by PeleusSPR

Evets: No I've never hacked at all
Everyone: Evets is well respected, he'd never hack!
*Replays are posted showing he hacks*
Evets: Ok, I hacked ONCE, never ever ever after or before, I'm so sorry, honest.
Everyone: Yay, Evets is bad but at least he's honest and admits to it, and it was only once. We should go easy on him. Of course we should believe him.
*Even more replays are shown with him maphacking*

Everyone: .............


People, this is why you never trust in what a hacker says, and why you should simply remove them from the community. He's proven TWICE now that he's untrustworthy, yet people still put faith in being able to 'reform' him. Why should I ever have to play in a tournament against someone like that with his record ever, let alone only 2-3 months from now.

I have to agree, he clearly lied even though he supposedly told the truth. and i dont see why people are so afraid of losing a hacker in the community, i dont care how nice he is, he cheated and lied.

Quick Comments

	wolf:
	MooZfY:	+1 smart..

[ToRSpartaz]

Originally Posted by FaDeBadger

This is actually quite incorrect. If you look back through the thread you will see several posts, most notably from PiG outlining exactly how he thought the replay was inconclusive at least. If anything, he was on the way to being cleared as "that game was a little suss but nothing we can prove".

He's got balls to admit it after it looked like, for the most part he would, "get away with it".

"Im a dwarf and im digging a hole, diggy diggy hole... diggy diggy hole"

Stop arguing, just leave it as is ^^ your not making it any better for yourselves. If people drop this case now, I for one would be a hell of a lot better. Wouldn't you? Just chill man

Quick Comments

	mGGDaedalus:	This is out of context in light of recent developments
	PiG:
	TAScarecrow:
	ROOT`iaguz:	He's not a Dwarf...
	mGMUSE:
	AxSGRiM:
	Shieldz:
	SPGDoG:	took that words straight out of my mouth :)

[FaDeBadger]

Originally Posted by Spartaz

"Im a dwarf and im digging a hole, diggy diggy hole... diggy diggy hole"

Stop arguing, just leave it as is ^^ your not making it any better for yourselves. If people drop this case now, I for one would be a hell of a lot better. Wouldn't you? Just chill man

If you actually follow through the whole thread, you'll notice since the new evidence has been posted/brought to light no one has defended him or said anything. It's the admin's call not ours. We acted right on the information we had at the time and our past dealings with him. It's over our heads now.

Quick Comments

	TAriiChard:
	TADivinity:	But you were a rude dickhead to many people - whether your defending was justified or not
	ToRSpartaz:	Divinity you are a boss <3
	AxSGRiM:	divinity fighting
	Shieldz:	so true divinity
	SPGDoG:	i agree with divinity

[ToRSpartaz]

Originally Posted by FaDeBadger

If you actually follow through the whole thread, you'll notice since the new evidence has been posted/brought to light no one has defended him or said anything. It's the admin's call not ours. We acted right on the information we had at the time and our past dealings with him. It's over our heads now.

Haha I know ^^ I was quoting Simon from the Yogscast XDDD

Quick Comments

asdfSchnitzel:

WOO Go Yogscast!

[syfChadMann]

I know at high level play of this game hacking is considered a seriously dog act..

but my opinion is that Hackers are not really in possession of testicles. Thats about it, ripping on EvetS over and over again is like putting down and alcholic at an AA meeting. If he is legit trying to be a better person and will stop hacking (legit reformed hacker) then give him a chance to write his wrongs... and prove that he will not hack again. Why not implement an indefinite ban from sc2sea competitions until EvetS can prove he has changed his way, then implement monitoring of all his games. The punishment of losing all credibility in the community is pretty sever and no doubt Evets has realised that the hacking was far from worth it.

imo, everyone should get a second chance... regardless of their crime. However, if he does it again - then there is obviously no reform for him and he should be ousted from the community.

Quick Comments

Rage:

He was given the chance - he denied it. Then when exposed, he lied AGAIN and said he only did it once.

[Dalvernex]

LOL. drama people. come on more show please
anyway this case will die down eventually. Unless you guys keep talking about it. SHOOT!

Oh ya, about killing esports! DONT RUIN IT! IT CURES CANCER!

Quick Comments

	TAriiChard:	...
	Bash:	what is this i dont even.
	TADivinity:	^
	mGGDaedalus:	You're not helping things dalv
	FaDeGofire:	hacking is serious
	asdfSchnitzel:	No....Just no.....

[TADivinity]

Just wondering...You guys said that you took into account that he was a nice guy and said sorry etc when you decided on his punishment.
But now you know that he lied to all our faces (again), and let you continue to make posts in this thread, partly based on that.

Does this change anything?

I think Light's words also compliment this:

Originally Posted by xGKingLight

To top it off you seemed liked a great guy when I spoke to you, and that further makes you untrustable - if you could smile and be nice to me while you cheated and shit, who knows what other lies you are capable of.

Notably, I dont care what FaDe does - thats up to them. Just wondering if the punishment would have been worse if he was a no-name to you??

Edit: I know you figured he hacked more than once - you made it clear in big red writing :P. But at the same time, a couple of paragraphs above that you said "He's a nice guy etc etc" ..Yet he obviously lied to you without hesitation?

Edit 2: Clarification: Aimed at sc2sea admins, not FaDe

[FaDeBadger]

Originally Posted by TADivinity

Just wondering...You guys said that you took into account that he was a nice guy and said sorry etc when you decided on his punishment.
But now you know that he lied to all our faces (again), and let you continue to make posts in this thread, partly based on that.

Does this change anything?

Notably, I dont care what FaDe does - thats up to them. Just wondering if the punishment would have been worse if he was a no-name to you??

Probably not specifically aimed at me, but I'll give my side anyway especially after your rep comment. Obviously I would have preferred if he had told us, so we didn't go on defending him when it turns out we shouldn't have been. That said, it doesn't change how I feel about him as a person. Sure he hacked in a game and then tried to cover his ass, but so what?

I can honestly say most people I know would do the same thing. It's human nature to try to minimise damage, and there are very very few people who wouldn't lie to do it.

In response to your rep comment, as far as I am concerned I was in no way rude to anyone with the exception of Timber, but I claim that was justified seeing as how he accused me of maphacking purely based on the fact I am friends with EvetS. Everything else was basically saying, you can't say he maphacked the whole time unless you post proof. Proof has been given, and we've stopped defending.

~Edit: the so what part is in reference to covering his ass, not hacking.

[crAzerk]

Originally Posted by TADivinity

Just wondering...You guys said that you took into account that he was a nice guy and said sorry etc when you decided on his punishment.
But now you know that he lied to all our faces (again), and let you continue to make posts in this thread, partly based on that.

Does this change anything?

Pretty sure whatever you said has already been addressed.
Before that, what does the bolded text refer to? The fact that he has maphacked more than once? If that's the case, somewhere in the thread it was already mentioned that yes, this was accounted for. (Can't seem to find it atm)


And for:

Originally Posted by TADivinity

Just wondering if the punishment would have been worse if he was a no-name to you??

Originally Posted by nirvAnA

And our decision was biased to the extent of him previously having a clean / good track record NOT because some of us are friends with him, that is just stupid and insulting to us at the same time. It is similar to how in court cases the jury reviews your history to see if you have been a "outstanding member of the community" or a "low life scumbag" before they deliver their verdict.

And if people missed the important posts:

SC2SEA's Official Statements (via nirvAnA)
First statement here, and next statement here,
Meatex, Clan leader of FaDe's statement:
Here

Please read these before posting if you wanted the 'official statements of the site, of FaDe'. As said, it's going in circles now. The sentence has been dealt, corrective measures have begun on FaDe's end, further posts about it do NOT really help or affect much besides create more negativity.

Move on, check out proTimbeR's accusation of a certain Ghost of hacking!

[TADivinity]

Originally Posted by crAzerk

Pretty sure whatever you said has already been addressed.
Before that, what does the bolded text refer to? The fact that he has maphacked more than once? If that's the case, somewhere in the thread it was already mentioned that yes, this was accounted for. (Can't seem to find it atm)

Nono, the fact that he lied in this thread twice - First denying it, and then secondly coming out with a statement (Which no doubt turned heads and some sympathy) which was also just lies.


And in regards to Nirvana's point on 'outstanding member of the community versus low life scumbag'

….That has been said in context, almost with the idea that he hasn't hacked for long. That’s silly – JazBas (Although he can't prove it) believes he has been hacking for a fair amount of time, and Riichard surely gives JazBas' beliefs some credibility.

With this retrospective point…can you really say EvetS has indeed been 'a good member of society'?? (Which seems to have swayed the result of his punishment?)

Quick Comments

	x5.Revenant:	A lot of other people(like Lost, myself, Rossi,etc) has mentioned about him lying so much before confessing it, but the admins seem to ignore this fact and didn't punish him for this course of action that he did.
	mGMUSE:

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by TADivinity

Nono, the fact that he lied in this thread twice - First denying it, and then secondly coming out with a statement (Which no doubt turned heads and some sympathy) which was also just lies.


And in regards to Nirvana's point on 'outstanding member of the community versus low life scumbag'

….That has been said in context, almost with the idea that he hasn't hacked for long. That’s silly – JazBas (Although he can't prove it) believes he has been hacking for a fair amount of time, and Riichard surely gives JazBas' beliefs some credibility.

With this retrospective point…can you really say EvetS has indeed been 'a good member of society'?? (Which seems to have swayed the result of his punishment?)

:/ :/ Since my rep post was truncated. I'll state it here again:

A lot of people like Lost, myself, Rossi etc has been mentioning about the course of action he took(denying, lying about it) before confessing that he was a hacker. Shouldn't it be good if there was some form of warning or punishment given to him taking this course of action? The purpose of this would serve a purpose of letting other hackers know that if you're being accused and you're guilty to admit it, instead of deceive people around you that you didn't do it, before finally admitting it.

I'm bringing this up, not to add oil to the fire, but because the admins may not have addressed this issue, or overlooked it. (Or maybe I've skipped a few posts; If that's the case do ignore this post.)

Edit: I just read through the entire thread again.

Now that Riichard has solid proof that EvetS has hacked more than what he admitted, I seriously think he deserves more than that. This essentially means that he lied/denied about hacking, confessed to hacking in ONE game, and in the end it was found out by Riichard that his confession is full of lies again. I'm sorry to be that harsh, but how the heck can we still ever trust a guy that lies over and over again?

I even asked him repeatedly if it was his honest words that he only hacked for one game over a series of posts, and he claimed that was the truth and some people, well at least I did, trusted his words. So hey,What the F@#$ dude? You just F@#$ed me silly.

Edit 2: This guy was given a chance to fess up. He blew the shyt out of it. I don't even know what to say anymore.

Quick Comments

	mGMUSE:
	Neoneoz:
	neKo:	Well said
	TragicHero:
	AxSGRiM:
	Shieldz:
	TAEdarus:

[FaDeGofire]

ok i just saw the riichard replay. that's clear proof of hacking. I am really disappointed in evets. he has lied directly to my face twice already. I was willing to stand up for him even at the cost of losing the community's respect but now i don't trust him anymore. I hope fade kicks him out. sorry for doubting muse and jazbas replays.

Quick Comments

	mGMUSE:
	Peleus:
	NvRossi:
	neKo:
	AxSGRiM:
	TAEdarus:

[mGMUSE]

Originally Posted by FaDeGofire

ok i just saw the riichard replay. that's clear proof of hacking. I am really disappointed in evets. he has lied directly to my face twice already. I was willing to stand up for him even at the cost of losing the community's respect but now i don't trust him anymore. I hope fade kicks him out. sorry for doubting muse and jazbas replays.

thank you.

i would just like to ask what has he done for the community specifically? just because he's an active GM(undeservingly so) on this site doesn't mean contribution, am i right?

Quick Comments

	AxSGRiM:
	Shieldz:
	TAEdarus:

[ToRSpartaz]

I love going off topic:

"Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah" - True words of Simon ^^

Edit: Yes it is a serious thread, but what you dont seem to grasp is the gravity of the situation we are. What this thread is doing isn't contributing to the community. Do not questions my motives, yes I am a leader I understand tge responsibility of that. But as you can clearly see this thread has pitted people against each other, essentially changing perceptions of each other which in some circumstances is considerably wrong.

Do you honestly think that a bit of humour actually affects the light of the discussion. The answer is no not in the slightest. Think before you negatively rep and think of the overall situation we are in -.-....

Seriously consider the direction of this conversation what effects it is having on Sc2sea and the SEA community. Just on ladder I have heard about this soo many times, I for one am leaving this in the hands of Nirvana and the mods. They have the best interests of the community at heart, I trust them to do what is best for SEA. So don't turn this into a witch hunt... Do it discretely at your own disgrestion (effed the speelling xD).

Don't take what I say lightly... Dont let all the many hours of fantastic work go to waste in building this incredibly community!! Mods this is on you guys. We trust you to make the best decisions

Quick Comments

	TADivinity:	This is a serious thread. Youre a leader, not a retard
	neKo:	What are you doing
	Bash:	Completely unrelated, going off topic had nothing to do with your "Explanation", it was silly.
	FaDeBadger:	Pointless on so many levels
	Shieldz:	stupid useless waste of time
	syfChadMann:
	TAEdarus:	I understand what you're TRYING to say, but I think you missed the point...

[Rage]

I don't think "having a clean record" should be a mitigating factor in the slightest.

In this case

-the multiple evidence replays of Evets hacking more than once
-lying about hacking at all initially
-lying AGAIN and saying he only did it once

given the above, to me, the only thing "had a clean record" means is "hadn't been caught until now".

And that makes it a pretty flimsy reason to do anything.

Quick Comments

TAEdarus:

[Ruscour]

Originally Posted by Rage

I don't think "having a clean record" should be a mitigating factor in the slightest.

In this case

-the multiple evidence replays of Evets hacking more than once
-lying about hacking at all initially
-lying AGAIN and saying he only did it once

given the above, to me, the only thing "had a clean record" means is "hadn't been caught until now".

And that makes it a pretty flimsy reason to do anything.

"Once" doesn't necessarily mean one game, it could just mean one session. I haven't been following this stuff too closely to see if it was over multiple days or anything but multiple replays can still justify "once".

We all have our moments of weakness. He was punished by his team and lost a ton of respect by the community. His apology had sincerity...it is hard to earn people's respect back but I can't see why he doesn't deserve a chance to do that.

SlayerSDragon was a proven maphacker, for crying out loud. People make mistakes and people change.

Quick Comments

	ToRSpartaz:	Well said man, true points. I want this thread buried...
	TAScarecrow:	"it was just this one ladder game" evetS
	TAEdgE:	^
	mGGDaedalus:	If you gonna post at least read the thread properly
	Nemo:	Yes, he deserves a second chance !
	TAEdarus:	"it was just this one ladder game" evetS
	Zealo:	good sentiment, normally i'd say read the thread before posting but the thread is 100 pages of shit at this point
	nGenLight:	Lol he was pretty sincere, lying pretty sincerely.
	sRFullstop:

[TAXanT]

Originally Posted by Ruscour

We all have our moments of weakness. He was punished by his team and lost a ton of respect by the community. His apology had sincerity...it is hard to earn people's respect back but I can't see why he doesn't deserve a chance to do that.

My thoughts as well

Edit: I understand people are disappointed with him for hacking, lying, etc and they have every right to be but I don't know what other punishment can be handed out other than getting booted out of FaDe/SC2SEA community. Trust is an important thing and hes broken it, more than once too. From what I've heard he was held in a rather high regard, at least within FaDe and his reputation has been destroyed now. In a way the easy option would be for him to become in-active on these forums but I hope that isn't the case. If he really wants to make up for his wrong-doings he'll hang around, start from the ground-up again and roll with the punches which will no doubt be thrown his way and hope that people give him the chance.

I don't know EvetS at all im completely un-biased in all this, just trying to find any positive direction this can be moved in.

[TragicHero]

Originally Posted by Ruscour

We all have our moments of weakness. He was punished by his team and lost a ton of respect by the community. His apology had sincerity...it is hard to earn people's respect back but I can't see why he doesn't deserve a chance to do that.

Sorry I had to reply you on this. From a neutral point of view, his apology can NOT be sincere since he lied about it. His apology clearly stated that he says sorry for hacking only ONCE against Timber, not any other time (EVER). How can his apology be sincere if he lied about it?

Quick Comments

	Rage:	Yes! I don't know how people can't see this.
	TAEdarus:	Bang on the mark.

[VB_WhiplashJC]

Consider what would happen if we didn't have this conversation. I don't know if you've played a game before that dissolved into cheaters at all levels after you'd put effort into improving at it and building a community, but it ******* sucks.

Quick Comments

	ToRSpartaz:	My point exactly brother, people cant seem to see this ideal... Clearly.. Well put my friend
	Welshy:

[nard]

Yes. He hacked. Yes. He lied. Is anyone forgetting that he is going through a tough time right now?

As far as cheating's concerned, it has been proven. Now can we give him a break and let him get his life in order without all this e-drama please?

I consider Evets a good friend, always ready for a chat online. To see this unfold was heartbreaking. I hope y'all would give him some space and understanding for a while.

Note space and understanding does not equate to forgiveness. Now that we've all agreed he's a hacker and what-not. Lets move on.

Quick Comments

	TAEdarus:	I didn't see anyone directly attacking him, we're discussing the issue.
	x5.Revenant:	Totally missing out all the valid points brought against him.
	Rage:	He cheated,denied it, then made an insincere apology veiled within yet another lie. No respect.
	NvJazBas:	-_-