[FaDeBadger]

Originally Posted by pRoTimber

who knows maybe he had shared the hack with his friends? maybe badger who keeps coming in defence? or who he got the hack from? why even bother about the meaningless punishment? i'd say send the hack to blizzard to fix it the next patch.

Yeah bro, I maphack my way all through Platinum.

[VoxMSI.Rogue]

Originally Posted by EdgE

Oh you guys share MSN drama

I am gonna start some drama with you on Skype Cam

Quick Comments

TAEdgE:

[TAEdarus]

Originally Posted by TARogue

I am gonna start some drama with you on Skype Cam

As long as there's a cam involved with you and Cam, i'd watch that...

[NvJazBas]

Originally Posted by Maynarde

JazBaz I was one of the people that defended EvetS (in the Community Open I hosted) when you messaged about his suspicious behaviour on ladder. Makes you wonder now Interested in seeing the replays but I don't know why we're arguing over the EvetS thing still.

Myself, iaguz and a few others have RE-stated that EvetS has already been punished. The horse is already dead, stop hitting it. He admitted to hacking = consequences = done.

Now go, to the ladder! Find more hackers and shine glorious retribution among them.

I just read the whole thing (and really late to the whole issue) so yes I wrote really late post. I was really angry and confused with some people defending him about "having the balls to own up to it" which I just don't get cause he didn't own up to it from the start.

It's 4:40am here but hell I'll go look through replays now.

Remember. Evets still haven't admitted that he hacked many games (which some people like me do not believe) and I'm just trying to get out the truth (at least the truth I believe) so its not beating up the dead horse again because right now, his only accused for hacking ONCE against Timber and few times back he was in diamond?

I'll post asap about the replay going to look through them now.

[NvJazBas]

How do I attatch a file?

[NvRossi]

try drop.sc to upload replays or a similar website

Quick Comments

NvJazBas:

sweet thx!

[EveVendetta]

JazBaz, chill man there's nothing much to prove, I'm pretty sure the rest of the community here are more or less certain that Evets did hack more than once, based on the various testimonials by e.g. you, muse, timbre. ( and in doing so Evets lied during his admission of hacking ONLY that one game).

The only people who are demanding evidence ( which is hard to find from seasons back, personally I don't save my replays) are a select few Clan Fade guys.

And Badger, it's not really beating a dead horse if this lying during his admission warrants a greater punishment to be decided by the admins. I guess its up to the admins to decide.

[NvJazBas]

http://drop.sc/80896

Ok firstly, I couldn't find the game I found suspicious (almost 100% certain) he was maphacking which was game against me because I deleted all the replays I had few weeks ago.

This game is the one I got after checking evets history after our game, knowing this IrlIAwp guy was the one who played evets after he playing me, and I somehow met him on ladder so I asked him of the replay.

Ok so about the replay, this replay don't have much of the evidence I was looking to give like the game he had vs me but few things still look suspicious

I was wrong about the 14th egg drone cancle (this was long time ago sorry for bad memory) it was just a mistake of 2 overloads at 9~10 supply cancling. Not many things in this game looks really suspicious and not very accusable but few things do look suspicious

14pool not gas first as in reaction to the 10 pool maybe? I don't know if this is the build PiG taught him to do back at that times but its not a very usual build.

Unusal rally inside mineral line at 2:15 right before Awp's pool finishes, saving larva to defend early aggression without scouting early pool also.

Really good ling placements before seeing which direction his opponents lings come in


14:00. He makes a round of lings rallied at the 3rd base without scouting (understandable)
14:50 He does a shift command attack on the 3rd expo of Awp's at his gold which he cancled his original 3rd and remade at the gold, without scouting right after it starts building clicking right in the middle of it (yes clicking the rock can be arguable but I don't know.. still without scouting anything)

But still, anything Evets did is arguable by saying "he had good game sense" as he had really good roach warren timings, drone timings etc.

Not the best game to accuse a player of maphacking but things did really look suspicious for me especially early game. I wish I can provide replay of my game vs Evets but thats not doable so yes this is all I can give and totally understandable if some people defending Evets don't buy it.


ps. Do not pause the replay before you see the shift command attack. I found out that if you pause a bit early, (14:49) you won't be able to see the shift command and you'll have to reload the replay

Quick Comments

FaDeGofire:

thanks for finding replay

[NvJazBas]

Originally Posted by EveVendetta

JazBaz, chill man there's nothing much to prove, I'm pretty sure the rest of the community here are more or less certain that Evets did hack more than once, based on the various testimonials by e.g. you, muse, timbre. ( and in doing so Evets lied during his admission of hacking ONLY that one game).

The only people who are demanding evidence ( which is hard to find from seasons back, personally I don't save my replays) are a select few Clan Fade guys.

And Badger, it's not really beating a dead horse if this lying during his admission warrants a greater punishment to be decided by the admins. I guess its up to the admins to decide.

I'm just certain myself that he hacked more than one gamea nd not very happy with the way "some" people are saying about this and feel angry about Evets admitting about hacking one game only which I personally think is a lie. I couldn't provide a good evidence so in the end its just opinion vs opinion but yeah, this is my opinion.

Originally Posted by FaDeBadger

Bring us proof and we may change our mind. Until then there is only one, possibly two instances of him hacking.

I'm saying, even if its just 1 game, how can anyone(you) defend him? He "admitted" he hacked after denying it.

[Nemo]

Well, 12 month ban = Life ban in SC2.

I personally would not understand that people could have been pardoned for racism and someone who has cheated and admit it (maybe partially) would not. Let keep things in perspective.

Remember too that people should be encouraged to admit after bad behavior. It's far worse for the community when they don't and they might get away with it ...

Quick Comments

VB_Rhuubarb:

Completely agree

[syfChadMann]

well now, this thread was entertaining.

Kids, what have we learnt?
- Hacking is bad. you might win, but your win is meaningless... If a meaningless win is what you are after, vs AI.
- While Evets has hacked, that doesn't have anything to do with FaDe, Therefore, you may individually lose respect for Evets as you see it fit - don't hate on FaDe, In my experience they are all a bunch of nice people!
- We all invest alot of emotion into this game.. eSports! #WINNING!
- Personally, I think if Evets knows what is good for him, he's not going to hack anymore - if he does, everyone will be watching their replays against him, he will get reported - then lose his account.
- hacking is bad.
- stay in school
- don't do drugs

[mGMUSE]

Originally Posted by xGKingJazBas

I'm just certain myself that he hacked more than one gamea nd not very happy with the way "some" people are saying about this and feel angry about Evets admitting about hacking one game only which I personally think is a lie. I couldn't provide a good evidence so in the end its just opinion vs opinion but yeah, this is my opinion.

Exactly my thoughts. According to him the only game he hacked in was yesterday in the game against timber, when I have played him since season 2 and found him suspicious in many of the games played. On top of that, apart from the testimonials given by the few reputable players around here - putting their reputation at risk Fade members(and a few others) still refuse to believe that he hacked in more than one game and starting from more than 3 seasons ago.

and for those people who think that i'm blindly calling him a maphacker please refer to this post http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55234&postcount=20

[mGGDaedalus]

Originally Posted by mGMUSE

Exactly my thoughts. According to him the only game he hacked in was yesterday in the game against timber, when I have played him since season 2 and found him suspicious in many of the games played. On top of that, apart from the testimonials given by the few reputable players around here - putting their reputation at risk Fade members(and a few others) still refuse to believe that he hacked in more than one game and starting from more than 3 seasons ago.

and for those people who think that i'm blindly calling him a maphacker please refer to this post http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55234&postcount=20

I don't think 'refusing to believe' is the right words. But for such a serious accusation, I just think substantial evidence should be provided and analysed/discussed.

[NvJazBas]

Originally Posted by xGKingJazBas

I'm just certain myself that he hacked more than one gamea nd not very happy with the way "some" people are saying about this and feel angry about Evets admitting about hacking one game only which I personally think is a lie. I couldn't provide a good evidence so in the end its just opinion vs opinion but yeah, this is my opinion.




I'm saying, even if its just 1 game, how can anyone(you) defend him? He "admitted" he hacked after denying it.

Originally Posted by mGMUSE

Exactly my thoughts. According to him the only game he hacked in was yesterday in the game against timber, when I have played him since season 2 and found him suspicious in many of the games played. On top of that, apart from the testimonials given by the few reputable players around here - putting their reputation at risk Fade members(and a few others) still refuse to believe that he hacked in more than one game and starting from more than 3 seasons ago.

and for those people who think that i'm blindly calling him a maphacker please refer to this post http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55234&postcount=20

Muse and I, both of us, I can say that we don't accuse anyone for no reason. I don't think I was ever wrong on "Oh I think OOO map hacks" because it just happens SO rarely. I can have endless losing streak (I had 8 loss streak vs pokerface and 6 vs YaMaMa -_-..) and still don't find anything suspicious like maphacking or whatever but just lost purely cause of skill difference in those games. In fact, the game I found suspicious of the game he vsed me was me actually winning. But the way he played was so suspicious that I went over the replay in his camera and found really suspicious stuff (I can't provide evidence sorry).

This case is not closed because Evets still havn't admitted on cheating many other games which I believe he did so I belive we can still argue over this and its not beating up a dead horse again. I am willing to risk the reputation I have from the community to prove this.

Quick Comments

	Peleus:
	Neoneoz:
	Eldrid:

[ChaynesOre]

Originally Posted by mGMUSE

Exactly my thoughts. According to him the only game he hacked in was yesterday in the game against timber, when I have played him since season 2 and found him suspicious in many of the games played. On top of that, apart from the testimonials given by the few reputable players around here - putting their reputation at risk Fade members(and a few others) still refuse to believe that he hacked in more than one game and starting from more than 3 seasons ago.

and for those people who think that i'm blindly calling him a maphacker please refer to this post http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55234&postcount=20

People have replied to this post as well though:

http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55240&postcount=24
http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55261&postcount=36

I watched the replay, and I play Zerg at a decent level and all of these things seem common subtleties to well-understood Zerg play to me. If you find other replays that are undeniable proof of hacking, I'll lynch him with you guys too, and I'm sure the "deciders" will crush him for lying about the single instance. But until then, it's settled. Let go of that game though. Find others -- all you need is one, right? Shouldn't be that hard..

[nGenLight]

No offense, but I wouldn't give any credibility to someone who just got caught cheating in a competitive game where people put their lives into. Who knows if you've hacked one time or one million times, and who cares how sincere your explanation/apology might have sounded, your credibility got shot the moment you started hacking and went further down the drain when you decided to deny it (although I do understand the social desire to negate bad press). To top it off you seemed liked a great guy when I spoke to you, and that further makes you untrustable - if you could smile and be nice to me while you cheated and shit, who knows what other lies you are capable of. You might even be a closet serial killer. Every insult/diss you are going to get/gotten will be completely deserving, shame on you for killing E-Sports.

Sure, don't get me wrong, admiting to it was a nice thing to do, but the moment you did you lost all your integrity. Although, I do believe it was a good gesture to do and one day people will forgive you and you could follow the footsteps of Sensei. But you will never be forgotten for what you did and your going to cop alot of shit, I feel mega sorry for you, but you freaking deserve it.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:	lol @ the closet serial killer!!!
	NvJazBas:
	MooZfY:	You like Pikachu? I LIKE PIKACHU TOO!
	asdfSchnitzel:	Our hero has returned? =D
	Neoneoz:
	TATheMoonStar:	well said
	ToRSpartaz:	Didnt you retire? o.O
	x5.Revenant:
	AxSGRiM:
	neon:	I really love your avatar. :D

[NvJazBas]

Originally Posted by chaynesore

People have replied to this post as well though:

http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55240&postcount=24
http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p=55261&postcount=36

I watched the replay, and I play Zerg at a decent level and all of these things seem common subtleties to well-understood Zerg play to me. If you find other replays that are undeniable proof of hacking, I'll lynch him with you guys too, and I'm sure the "deciders" will crush him for lying about the single instance. But until then, it's settled. Let go of that game though. Find others -- all you need is one, right? Shouldn't be that hard..

Yes apart from the drone pull at the start.

Give me one replay of any zerg player who does that without seeing a scv in sight.

Remember, he did not see the scv coming at all and he pulled back at the perfect timing. I can asure you you cannot find a replay of any zerg doing that. Especially on maps like TDA where its 4 player map and chances of Terran scouting that early in the right direction is minimal.

[cRSenSei]

Originally Posted by xGKingiaguz

If you're going to get this worked up over hackers then why is SenSei still in TA?

Evets feels really shitty over this. The punishment has worked, to an extent, and if anyone else gets caught out with this shit we can easily be nastier to them.

Wtf is this suppose to mean? I have never touched anything in starcraft 2, this was dealt with over 5 years ago why is it still being brought up.

I dealt my time what. What has it got to do with the now?

I won't even bother putting in my 2c about what evets has done/tried to cover up what he did but he is getting off very lightly compared to what I would expect.

I expected more from you Ethan..

Quick Comments

SPGDoG:

[nGenLight]

^ Maphacking in Starcraft I/II is like commiting pedophile rape. You may get off after 10-20 years but your name will be dragged through the mud.

That said even Pedophiles can return to be total class acts - as Sensei have shown.

Quick Comments

TeZzA:

Sensei is now #1 Pedophile.

[FaDeGofire]

It's not that FaDe is condoning maphacking. It's that there is no clear evidence that evets has done it perpetually. A maphacker is a maphacker. But surely there should be different punishments for the extent of maphacking. Someone who cheats in a CO vs someone who cheats every game on ladder vs someone who used a hack once during a difficult period.

If you believe that evets has only cheated once or twice then the 2 month ban is fair, which is what the admins of sc2sea and some of fade believe. If you think that evets has been maphacking for a long time and is still lying to everyone then I completely understand why you are upset at the current punishment.

However, you cannot condemn someone without sufficient proof. I'm glad that jazbaz, muse, and timber brought out the replays and appreciate that they are not doing it lightly. The more replays the better the community can judge the situation. I want to know the truth as well. If there are clear replays of him hacking on multiple occasions then I personally would not want him still in fade as it means he would have lied to everyone too many times to gain back my trust.

Regarding jazbas' replay.. what stood out to me was the lack of scouting/map control he had.. he made units but hardly ventured outside his natural.. What if his opponent was super greedy or went for muta. Whether he was hacking or not i'd leave that up to the pro players who know a lot more about zvz.