[Zanderax]

Bad Manners. We all know it when we see it. People raging off their rockers at others because their play isn't as good or they are just unsportsmanlike. Sure it's fun to watch people like IdrA get some raging in at the end of his play but nobody likes it when it happens to them. It is distinctly not fun when you pull off an awesome play and the player you just beat, rather than complimenting you on cunning strategy and epic micro, decides to throw a few swears your way and bring your mother sexuality into question.

Now I'm no hero, I don't expect to lessen how much BM comes out in SC2 but I do want to pose the question: What do you consider to be BM. Raging, swearing, and insults aside, what do you find to be insulting when you play. I have come up with some starting things that I find insulting when a player loses (and sometimes wins). If you want to add to the list, just post a reply. I hope we can learn from this about what other people find insulting and try to limit that in our play.

BM when they lose:
- Insults/Raging/Swearing
- Not leaving the game eg. floating buildings/making extrators or pylons when you have no army
- No GG
- Reporting you to Blizzard for no reason (I've had it happen before)
- Brushing aside your win eg. "I was playing crap" or "I'm masters on my NA"
- False GGing

BM when they win
- Manner actions eg Building Hatches in your main, setting up pylons all in your base.
- Brushing off their win "I was playing crap" or "I failed the entire game"
- Prolonging the game needlessly
- Offensive GGing (saying gg when you're pretty sure you've won, before your opponent gg's)

I was thinking of including - Continuing the game even after you've left, but you wouldn't know so I left it out.

[x5_Potter]

Waiting to get a massive army to destroy your very last building
I think this one is silly to include, as if you have one building left, why the hell is somebody still in the game?

[FaDeBadger]

I don't think no gg is bm. If I don't feel like it was a good game, then I don't gg. Manner hatches/pylons/nexus whatever is also not bm as far as I am concerned. And as Potthead said, I think it would be considered bm of you if you are still in the game with only one building.

People put too much emphasis on bm. It's a game, they are a person potentially on the other side of the world. Who gives a shit if they think you played bad or want to rage. People need to harden the **** up and get over it.

Quick Comments

	deL:	Agreed about the gg
	Synizta:	Indeed. so annoying when i get called BM for not saying gg.
	ToRSmotPokingFish:	not saying gg isnt bm, there is no rule saying you must gg

[TABjornbrandr]

BM to me is essentially doing something in game that you wouldn't do to someone if you were face-to-face with them.
Would you abuse someone if they held off your shitty cheese when they're sitting opposite you in a booth on stage? Probably not.
Would you deliberately prolong a game if they can see you? Probably not.

Essemtially, if it would make you look like a dick in real life, then it's exactly the same on the internet.
People who hide behind the internet are BM, that's how I see it.

[deL]

I do it in real life too T_T Usually more so because it's probably a tournament or event and means more than losing a simple ladder game. It's about getting angry at myself more than my opponent though, even though it doesn't always come out that way :P

I don't think no gg/manner mules/manner buildings can be considered too BM, that's a little oversensitive. Personal or racist insults and continuing shit after the game is more likely to be BM.

[crAzerk]

"Prolonging the game needlessly"

This doesn't seem to be BM on the winner's side - he could just not be clear about how much ahead he is and wants to play it safe, in case there's hidden expos, etc.
More often than not, this is on the loser's side - why are you not GG-ing out when you are clearly behind?

[TABjornbrandr]

Originally Posted by crAzerk

"Prolonging the game needlessly"

This doesn't seem to be BM on the winner's side - he could just not be clear about how much ahead he is and wants to play it safe, in case there's hidden expos, etc.
More often than not, this is on the loser's side - why are you not GG-ing out when you are clearly behind?

Whilst the meaning of the statement is open to personal interpretation, I would assume that if you are unsure of your advantage, that would not be classified as needlessly prolonging the game, but rather as playing the game safe. If, however, you knew your opponent was pretty gone, then screwing around for longer than needed could be considered BM, especially in a tournament setting where schedules are generally quite tight and need to be adhered to as much as possible.

[Pox]

While I see a gg as more of a respectful custom than as a literal acknowledgement of a good game, not gging isn't a big deal - some people do it, some don't. Comments like "I was playing poorly" can be hurtful, but often it's just the truth, so I'm on the fence with that one. Any straight-up insults are obviously bm.

[inFeZa]

I hear ZergGirl knows a thing or two about BM .. n_n

I try to keep my manner when im under my name in a 1v1, if its a team game, then all BM breaks loose

[Meatex]

prolonging the game needlessly is absolutely 100% bm
in fact i'd say one of the worse forms of bm

Why?
Because I get so little time to actually play i don't want to spend 30 minutes ending a game that finished in 10 minutes. Its utterly disrespectful and makes me want to punch the opponent in the dick.

Name calling can be shrugged off easily
I cannot get that wasted time back and its not even worthy of calling it practice

Now if it is a position where a comeback is slightly possible okay
But if I have a base surrounded by spores and spines (actually 2 other hidden bases as well) and a big roach hydra army killing all the buildings you don't try to rebuild a hidden base you gg out.
And that game was over well before that was happening

[FYRE]

Coming from a Halo background, good manner is one of the most foreign concepts I have come across in the Starcraft 2 scene. Playing Halo 2/3/Reach online, everyone would insult the shit out of the opposite team, smacktalking them not because we were angry, but because it was FUN. I don't think BM should ever be taken seriously, as its almost never genuinely directed at the player themselves, but is a result of rage/fun/boredom.

Quick Comments

ZC.EvilSWAT:

I used to play Halo competitively, and I agree that SOME types of BM are made in jest. (We know your momma ain't really fat. Right?)

[Cute]

Originally Posted by SQLTt.inFeZa

I hear ZergGirl knows a thing or two about BM .. n_n

I try to keep my manner when im under my name in a 1v1, if its a team game, then all BM breaks loose

I don't play team games too often, but from what I gather, being BM in 2v2/3v3/4v4 is a highly desirable skill to possess

[ZC.EvilSWAT]

Bah, all your mommas are so fat that there's not enough space in this thread to describe her.

[TAavanar]

Originally Posted by FaDeMeatex

prolonging the game needlessly is absolutely 100% bm
in fact i'd say one of the worse forms of bm

Why?
Because I get so little time to actually play i don't want to spend 30 minutes ending a game that finished in 10 minutes. Its utterly disrespectful and makes me want to punch the opponent in the dick.

Name calling can be shrugged off easily
I cannot get that wasted time back and its not even worthy of calling it practice

Now if it is a position where a comeback is slightly possible okay
But if I have a base surrounded by spores and spines (actually 2 other hidden bases as well) and a big roach hydra army killing all the buildings you don't try to rebuild a hidden base you gg out.
And that game was over well before that was happening

If you hate people prolonging the game when your the one whos behind, why arent you leaving. If they are that far ahead that they are '"prolonging" the game why arent you out of the game?
I also hate people who dont say GG, i dont care if it wasnt an actual good game, does it hurt for you to type gg before you leave a game? GG doesnt actually mean it was a good game in most cases, it means i surrender you win.

Quick Comments

	Meatex:	comprehend before calling out please
	mGGDaedalus:	you read it backwards mate
	Bielsko:	GG actually does mean good game... and I only say it when my opponent wins and not when I lose from silly mistakes.

[DeekZ]

I'd consider myself a pretty BM player. I don't take losing well so if I lose to something super cheesy or gimmicky I tend to rage. xD

I leave most games on ladder without gg'ing even if I'm not raging. I look at "gg" as a respectful custom, not as something I have to do and leaving without gg'ing shouldn't be considered BM, especially if it wasn't a good game. Same with "glhf" I don't personally give a shit if the person I'm vs'ing is having fun and I certainly don't want them to get lucky lol.

In my opinion the following things should be considered BM:
Raging in-game/insulting
Extending lost games (and by this I mean flying away buildings after you lose to a ground rush)
Offensive GGing (saying gg when you're pretty sure you've won, before your opponent gg's)

[mGGDaedalus]

Ladder is much less personal than say a clan custom game or tourney or something, I don't think rage is such a big deal in ladder games. If someone rages at me, I usually feel good because I played well enough to make them mad.

As for myself, since I know I have a tendency to rage when I'm in a bad mood, I generally adopt a silence policy on ladder and don't gl hf so that I don't seem rude when I don't gg. It really doesn't matter anyway, unless you strike up a random conversation with your opponent for some reason (if I chat to my opponent then I'd feel bad not gg'ing)

Quick Comments

Rockstar:

[Zanderax]

New ones added!

Also by prolonging the game I mean something like this:
You have 5 or 6 bases and he is confined to just 2. You have a 170/200 army but you wait to get a Mothership or kill off your own units to kill him in the best way possible.

That said the other person should just GG. It more of a shared thing.

[EveMassacrisM]

I consider Terran flying their shit off, landing CCs and making PFs then massing Barracks at a random location after his main getting roflstomped bm. Hell, I would totally call out their moms' sexuality and verbally abuse them afterwards.

[DeekZ]

The thing about BM is that it doesn't matter at all, if you get raged at and insulted you should just feel good, I know when someone calls me trash and insults the race I play I just laugh and ask them if they're mad and when I insult someone on ladder after I've lost its just a mini release of anger, which helps me going in to my next game. I don't BM in clan games or friendly customs.. you'd have to be a pretty huge douche to insult a clan mate, at least in a non-joking around way.

Honestly I think 'e-sports' would be better off if people just forgot about the term "BM" and didn't care about it, as we all know from watching players like IdrA and Destiny trash talking just makes everything more entertaining and in other sports trash talking is a great thing.

It's a real stretch to call some of the things in this thread BM, like not killing your opponent just because you're way ahead, not saying glhf and not gg'ing isn't BM, at least on ladder and "brushing aside your win/loss" is definitely not BM lol, at least not in the way I'm picturing it.

[UncleTom]

Sticks and stones can break your bones but words can never hurt you.