[ToRXypha]

Its not abusing IMO thats the intention of the ability, to 'abuse' it is to use it for its intended purpose, which constitutes it as being strategy.

think this game has 2 parts strategy and tactics.
Strategy is the bigger picture, ( i'll take this upgrade and build these units in this game againts that player because...,)
Tactics is the way you employ your strategy and make it win. eg using the high ground, flanking and getting surrounds and all that micro that i just haven't got right yet . well thats my 2 cents anyway from a gold leaguers perspective.

[happieness]

well i just started playing multiplayer 3 days ago, however the strategy u mentioned is one that i make to good use, good for defensive or offensive purposes.

recently won a game, TvP he went forge/void, i manage to delay voids but to push properly i didn have the units to sacrifice so i send ahead 13 scvs to absorb cannons and use thor/marau to finish him off. and its esp good for blocking, coming from alot of WC3 ladder

[OxygeN]

xypha : i think i agree with whatever you said, if you have to boil down everything, SC2 in its purest form would be as you mentioned both strategy and tactics. Though, the hard part is to master it, not understand it!

happieness : lol! I bet you played human or orc in wc3!

[TAEdgE]

Yeh it is good to abuse what is available, if you do it well, who's gonna stop you? Unlike a lot of terrans, you actually put thought into how to use what is advantageous to you, and i respect that. I hope you didn't take it as any imbalance whining, i just wish zerg had some cool little techniques like that. Damn defensive queens!

[happieness]

zerg has pretty damn strong offensives and probably the fastest expander.

[happieness]

You Tube

You Tube

watch this replay of the zerg.

[TAEdgE]

happiness i'm well aware of things like that, i try and incorporate it whenever i feel comfortable too, but that is so late into a game, and surviving until then in a good position is what the game is about. OxygeN is using terrans unique 'energy investment' (orbital command) to the fullest early on, while zerg uses queens for macro.

I guess you could say perfect queen usage (creep spread, constant spawn larvaing) is a great asset in any game of any style, not just one off things possibly like things discussed in this thread. I guess it's just how the mule/orbital is designed though, being able to make up for lost scvs and get a huge income in an instant if saved up, or used smartly like this. Protoss probably has the least interesting mechanic with chrono boost basically being a 'speed up' process, but warp gate is pretty damn sick.

Once zerg evolves more drops/nyduses will be more common. I've already experimented with Nydus army escapes when attacking expos. It's great!

[NvPinder]

Doesn't really matter how you like to sugar coat it, if someones entire play style revolves around never moving off one base and just doing cute timing attacks pulling half your workers and just praying you kill the guy then and there, it's a style that whilst is working well for people right now as people are still optimizing the 'standard' builds in this game, will simply get less and less effective as there's a very low skill ceiling on what the one-basers are doing and they will optimize it very quickly, meanwhile everyone else will keep on getting better and better, and the one-basers results if they continue to play this way will fade into insignificance.

there will always be a place for these strats in the game, in fact you almost need to play like this every once in a while if you're playing tournaments, because otherwise people will just punish your macro heavy style by playing even more economically aggressive and crush you mid-game anyway, however the players that simply 1-base over and over and over (ladder is plagued with these, because A) it's MUCH easier than playing for the late-game in mind, and B) it's not like you need to win a Bo3/5/7 series in ladder, its just singular games against random people that you're likely to not run into again for quite a while C)Half of climbing the ladder is gaming as much as possible, obviously the quicker you can win the better it is for climbing the ladder), are not going to progress as a player very far and they're just going to find their results getting worse rather than better.

Quick Comments

x5.Revenant:

[OxygeN]

Originally Posted by JPMoney

meanwhile everyone else will keep on getting better and better, and the one-basers results if they continue to play this way will fade into insignificance.

there will always be a place for these strats in the game, in fact you almost need to play like this every once in a while if you're playing tournaments.

That is quite contradictory there, if it is insignificant, why use it? lol.

But I agree with your post in the sense that there is a low celling on how good the one-base strat can get, that is rather undisputed, and obvious.

1 base maximum you can get is potentially 100food?

There is the celling right there.

[NvPinder]

hhhmmm, yeah sorry, I did actually mean 2 different things by those 2 lines i just didnt express myself very clearly, there will always be a place for using these strategies every now and again as a way to kind of balance your range of builds like you would in poker... eg: think of a cheesy all-in as a bluff in poker, if all you ever do is go all-in every hand in poker, bluffing 99% of the time, people are going to start realizing and are just going to start calling you whenever they had the odds to do so against the 100% range of hands you have and you will lose money very very quickly, however at the same time if you never bluff in poker and only play with strong quality hands, people will also catch on and will simply begin to fold anything every time you bet unless they have an absolute monster, thus simply playing both extreme ends of the spectrum will lose you money and you must figure out the right amount of bluffs to use in order to keep your image at the table solid. Just like you must use the right amount of cheesy all-ins in starcraft to keep your image solid and your opponents scared that you do have the potential to pull this out on them, stopping them from going something ultra greedy like a 16 nexus build. And at the same time if you always do cheesy all-ins, people will start realizing this, play very safe against you, and just make it to mid-game fine and crush you there.

[Exultant]

^ In other words, be versatile. But really, who's gonna be senseless enough to do the same macro tactic over and over if you're playing against someone familiar. Just do the same tactic to randoms if you want and vary your play when your're being recorded/ in comps.

Ye i agree that in time, there will be tons more macro-oriented games. Just like in BW, it's the traditional way of winning.

I'm noob and love one basing, faster games and usually works bahaha.