[Rail]

Hi,

I won't ask for someone to list all the "standard timings," but I often hear things from high level players/commentators that a player "should have X by Y timing," or "its odd to see X less drones for Y timing/build."

Now my question is, how exactly does one go about learning all these? Considering how many builds and variations of builds that are out there, I was wondering the actual methodology behind learning these exact "standards." I'm not asking for someone to list these things, but I've rarely ever come across any guides or posts detailing how people go about learning what standard exactly is...

Do you just go through mass replays/vods and write down EVERYTHING you see? Or is there some secret resource hidden away somewhere for GM/Masters players only?

Thanks

[eCKo`Tazerenix]

Beyond strict build orders, understanding "timings" is just a matter of game sense. You get better at it as you play more games and focus harder on the games you do play.

[mGGAequitas]

you just know

play more and you will know more

[Cordance]

The reason a lot of guides will not list "standard" timings is because a lot of them are based on the meta game which shifts in cycles. Basically they change to much, also they change massively based on skill of the players which makes them very league/location dependent. A good way to see this is watch Pig coaching someone to make max roaches. He will normally give them a time they can reach max roaches vs a time they will probably reach it at their skill level this is compared to the time they actually reach it on their first attempt.

You say with so many builds however when you get down too high level play and focus on some significant builds. Discounting specially designed cheese. There is really only likely 5 strong timings in common use with any given race. You can remove at least one of these given the race vs race, Two or three of these can be dropped as soon as scouting is done. A good reason for this I remember from a Day9 daily probably years ago now. Q: How do you know they will go X. A: Because X is the strongest thing we have to worry about if they go Y its just not that strong so we can probably deal with it from just playing a solid macro.

Standard timings are the fast strong ways to get to X. They can also be based on just the time to reach X. If you watch GSL you will notice in when PvX Colossus will normally come out at the same time when they are building towards them. ZvZ Mutas come out normally so close to each other they are with in a inject cycle of each other if not closer. These things become so standard because it comes down to worker mining times to how long they take to get out. Which is why you will hear in casts its "about" standard X timing, early game pressure might add 0-1 min to any mid game timing.

As mentioned star sense comes from playing and playing, this is when you see people put down turrets just as your building Mutas.

As far as yourself you will find some pros will actually have a notebook handy near by and they will note down X happened at Y when they where doing a build like Z. So if they see Z again they can compare its X and Ys and see if they are the same or similar. This kind of learning is great for some and useless for others. Most standard timings people learn to are ones that kill you if you are not ready for them and they "lost a few games"* to them.

As far as the "hidden" resource of pros its playing other pros. The higher level of play the narrower the scope of wiggle room in early and mid game. That and they tend to talk to each other.

* "Lost a few games" is a special phrase used by coach and students it means a number greater than 1 but more likely ranging into the hundreds and thousands.

[Rail]

@Cordance
I wish these forums had a like button, that post gave me a lot of confirmation about the things I was thinking!

Rather than specific timings for the current meta, I was looking for a clear answer or discussion on how others learn these timings (the methodology, so it can be applied regardless of what the current meta is). So far the consensus seems to be "play a lot" but I was wondering if anyone has simply mass-analysed high-level replays - it feels like a pain in the butt to do manually, so I was hoping someone had some handy tool to help with it.

[uJeanZ]

I find that watching your replays helps to give a better sense of opponents timings. Whether win or lose I like to go back and watch the replay and make a few notes. Helps me remember