[Sedz]

Kice is still a GM level player, I've seen him play in person, but he's definitely not good enough to be taking games off the best, that much we know. Now, if we take what Seo has said himself, that he doesn't do coaching, and we know his english is horribly broken, we put two and two together and can assume it was Kice coaching, this can be further proved by his students.

Now, Kice obviously got a bit of business through being a TGM (Whether or not he was recognised as a coach legitimately or not, I'm not questioning) but he also got a lot of business through word and mouth, evidence his coaching was obviously beneficial to people who sought after it.

Sure he may have achieved his TGM title through smurfs on his account, but you can't deny customers were satisfied with his coaching, they paid money, and they received a beneficial and worthwhile service, so it seems illogical that he is made to pay back the money he received from coaching.

Quick Comments

	Bash:	logic is good!
	AsGNabi:	Just to add: He was on mic to students during lessons.
	CHoBo(kice):

[AsGNabi]

Originally Posted by SundeR

Nabi - the smurfing incident didn't just occur 'recently', it's been going on for a long long time - this is proven in confessions by both parties. You don't understand that simply being in Grandmaster League is not enough to offer the high level, quality coaching that SC2SEA wants to give to people in The Grandmaster Manual scheme.

I don't think you understand and seem to have great difficulty accepting the fact that Chobo's students were satisfied in his coaching. If they weren't, I'm sure they would have at least complained or stopped going to him and he would have eventually been taken off from coaching.

Quick Comments

	iM SundeR:	totally irrelevant. if he didnt smurf he would have no students, why dont you get this
	CHoBo(kice):

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by cR.ChadMann

I think the issue isn't so much the students - but he cheated out other legitimate Terran coaches.. HuT or iaguz could have been able to provide the service - that they have legitimately obtained the ability to give.

That's a fair concern. When I first contacted CHoBo for coaching, I don't think HuT was a recognised coach yet. The only other option was Yoon, who was long term inactive thanks to uni. Is iaguz back coaching? I don't think he's coached in the entire time I've been a member of SC2SEA, he does hang around and drop some pretty sweet knowledge in the TGM forums though, and anywhere it's needed for that matter.

I think we're talking extremes here though - there's no reason someone has to go to a TGM coach for coaching, and there's no reason CHoBo can't offer coaching off his own back without endorsement from this site, and that's still fair competition. But yes, when the overlap happens for people (probably most on here) who will prefer a TGM coach and had the choice and went with CHoBo due to his record (probably less so), that's very valid.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:	iaguz is back!
	CHoBo(kice):

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by nirvAnA

To clarify, he only became a TGM coach in Jan, and pretty sure it because of SeoHyeon's skill

This statement says it all. Kice does not have the qualifications to be a TGM Coach. That wraps it up, end of story.

[inFeZa]

Why are you guys still defending him?
He cheated, Provoked everyone and denied claims, Banned and punished.
Its over. Its done.

Quick Comments

	VB_Rhuubarb:	Yep, time for everyone to move on
	nirvAnA:
	breadfan:	No one is defending any wrongdoing that I can see.

[nGenLight]

He earnt his money fair and square, but he cheated to get into a position to earn his money. It is like paying for a degree, or getting other people to do your exams for you then getting a sick job. He shouldn't cough up the money because he earnt it with his own time and effort, but he did cheat other people who should have got those job opportunities. He should be stripped of his job/title/shamed and punished, but coughing up money he earnt himself? I don't think that's right.

Quick Comments

nirvAnA:

this. and all his students are actually satisfied as you can see

[nirvAnA]

What infeza & Light said, and what already has been done. Closed.

Quick Comments

VB_Rhuubarb:

Finally :D