[Bloodmyst]

Originally Posted by TAChadMann

@ Erasmus - I wasn't suggesting they take the emotion out of the game.. but like you said.. MKP never rages or BMs .... at least not in public. And I totally disagree with your comment -

"That is an issue for sponsors, and not the community. If the sponsors (or teams that have said sponsors) feel that such behaviour reflects negatively on their company they will take them aside and tell them to shape up or lose the sponsorship."

This community site is the gateway to new sponsors. while current sponsors might tell their players that they need to manner up or try and be a bit more professional in public - bad attitudes and kids raging over games isn't going to have new sponsors rushing in.

moral of the story - act professional if you want to be treated as a grown up competing in eSports.

Just my 2 cents,

I agree with Erasmus here, however I also agree with "the community site is the gateway to new sponsors." Sponsors only care about the numbers game and how much exposure they get, Idra is a perfect example of this! If there is something much more serious such as racism I guess that is when sponsors will make sure it is dealt with asap. But small shit talk like this.... seriously?

As long as the sponsored players/teams are getting that exposure, thats all the sponsors really care about... money. It really shouldn't matter that much what the community thinks about someone and how they behave.. "that much."

If anything, people love the drama. It's not exactly a bad thing. It only attracts more attention = exposure.

P.S - Tgun, you really are deserving of that Mr Confident Award... haha..

[nGenLight]

Godamn it! The adults have taken over the thread, leave us gamers alone!!!

Quick Comments

NOM:

Just wanna play video games

[iM tgun]

Originally Posted by kiP

Just my 2 cents,

I agree with Erasmus here, however I also agree with "the community site is the gateway to new sponsors." Sponsors only care about the numbers game and how much exposure they get, Idra is a perfect example of this! If there is something much more serious such as racism I guess that is when sponsors will make sure it is dealt with asap. But small shit talk like this.... seriously?

As long as the sponsored players/teams are getting that exposure, thats all the sponsors really care about... money. It really shouldn't matter that much what the community thinks about someone and how they behave.. "that much."

If anything, people love the drama. It's not exactly a bad thing. It only attracts more attention = exposure.

P.S - Tgun, you really are deserving of that Mr Confident Award... haha..

Not sure if insult or compliment

[Fourby]

Who cares if insult or compliment. Just be confident yo

Quick Comments

Baldie:

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by Fourby

@erasmus
iirc just storming off without leaving the game IS bm and rude so everything you just said is irrelevant because what happened at those moments were so far over the top .

If you were to use tennis again. It's like the guy is on the brink of losing the last set but doesn't even play the last set and jut storms out of the stadium, depriving his opponent of the satisfaction of actually winning..

Now that being said, this was how I felt at the time(was so awkward i didnt know what to do so i just sat there shooting the rest of his buildings for 5 mins while everyone was silent lol) and no one has mentioned that he came back and straight away shook my hand and we still went out to dinner after and was all back to the same old with no awkward moments

Oh, I agree with that. I was talking a little more generally, but yes, that is definitely rather bm.

And also with what chad responded with, my other point is this. I would not go up to deth after he behaved like that and tell him I think he's a dick, and a disgrace to his team for that bahviour (I wouldn't anyway since he came back and apologised, and I've already said my feelings are bit more lenient than some due to stress, etc.) but I would go up to Dox and ask him wtf he is doing paying that arsehole to represent his team, and any sponsors his team is trying to acquire. And if I thought Dox was just blowing me off, I'd contact his teams sponsors and tell them 'hey, THIS is what you're paying this dude for... is that what you want your brand image to be?'.

And I would be letting them deal with the issue.

Quick Comments

raycey:

You're a fuking dickhead, you have no idea

[Fourby]

well dox was sitting next to me (deth on the left, dox on the right and a monitor inbetween XD) I needed to say nothing as the frustrations of the frame drops was getting to everyone from the biggining. I understood his pain, although i personally wouldnt have done it the same way he did lol.

and on that note, zerg imba - mass lings almost crashes the computers there lol.

[Dox]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

Oh, I agree with that. I was talking a little more generally, but yes, that is definitely rather bm.

And also with what chad responded with, my other point is this. I would not go up to deth after he behaved like that and tell him I think he's a dick, and a disgrace to his team for that bahviour (I wouldn't anyway since he came back and apologised, and I've already said my feelings are bit more lenient than some due to stress, etc.) but I would go up to Dox and ask him wtf he is doing paying that arsehole to represent his team, and any sponsors his team is trying to acquire. And if I thought Dox was just blowing me off, I'd contact his teams sponsors and tell them 'hey, THIS is what you're paying this dude for... is that what you want your brand image to be?'.

And I would be letting them deal with the issue.

You weren't even there, you're making it into a bigger deal than it was. You're out of line. Stop commenting.

(If you think we haven't already spoken to deth about it before this thread was created, you're very dense.)

Quick Comments

Fourby:

comment about dox and sponsors was very out of line. <3 dox

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by Dox

You weren't even there, you're making it into a bigger deal than it was. You're out of line. Stop commenting.

(If you think we haven't already spoken to deth about it before this thread was created, you're very dense.)

No, I'm responding to chadmann specifically when he argued (disagreed w/e) with me over the statement that I don't think dealing with this shit is a community issue, it is an issue for teams/sponsors to work out. That was just me saying what I -would- do (i.e. contact you) IF I thought the issue deserved it. Obviously I didn't, so I'm not making into a bigger deal.

Please read, or stop commenting.

Quick Comments

	Snx.FigJig:	shut up erasmus, youve commented on so many things you have no knowledge of
	JoFritzMD:	I don't see why it's so hard for people to see what you mean

[Dox]

You're calling a guy an "arsehole" when he didn't do anything to you. You understand that, right?

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by Dox

You're calling a guy an "arsehole" when he didn't do anything to you. You understand that, right?

Again. Hypothetical. I said this a few times. IF I thought he'd done something to warrant that kind of message, then I would feel that way about it.

This even started with fourby telling me I was underselling the BM that went on; saying that I understand that trying to be a programer in SEA with such limited oppurtunities is incredibly stressful and every single result is so critical to them.

[Fourby]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

This even started with fourby telling me I was underselling the BM that went on; saying that I understand that trying to be a programer in SEA with such limited oppurtunities is incredibly stressful and every single result is so critical to them.

Yes it was bad, but the thing is he didnt direct any anger directly at me, for all we knew he was just frustrated at the quality of the computers/lag causing him the losses which is where is anger was directe, as he was having a perfect run then losing to westly where frame drops were a factor (im not taking anything away from west, he played very well). If he got up and told me a was a cock sucker that would have been completely unacceptable.

What dox is saying is you dont really know all the details and you just assumed that dox hadent swiftly dealt with the issue already.

Undoubtably deth needs to work on some stress management and with some support he will get there, there is no need to go ahead and try to destroy the opportunites of a player with such potential.

[ROOT`iaguz]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

Oh, I agree with that. I was talking a little more generally, but yes, that is definitely rather bm.

And also with what chad responded with, my other point is this. I would not go up to deth after he behaved like that and tell him I think he's a dick, and a disgrace to his team for that bahviour (I wouldn't anyway since he came back and apologised, and I've already said my feelings are bit more lenient than some due to stress, etc.) but I would go up to Dox and ask him wtf he is doing paying that arsehole to represent his team, and any sponsors his team is trying to acquire. And if I thought Dox was just blowing me off, I'd contact his teams sponsors and tell them 'hey, THIS is what you're paying this dude for... is that what you want your brand image to be?'.

And I would be letting them deal with the issue.

That's bullshit Reddit logic. It's the ******* internet equivalent of A Current Affair. HEY GAIS HERE'S A NON ISSUE LET'S START WITH THE NAMING AND SHAMING.

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by Fourby

Yes it was bad, but the thing is he didnt direct any anger directly at me, for all we knew he was just frustrated at the quality of the computers/lag causing him the losses which is where is anger was directe, as he was having a perfect run then losing to westly where frame drops were a factor (im not taking anything away from west, he played very well). If he got up and told me a was a cock sucker that would have been completely unacceptable.

What dox is saying is you dont really know all the details and you just assumed that dox hadent swiftly dealt with the issue already.

Undoubtably deth needs to work on some stress management and with some support he will get there, there is no need to go ahead and try to destroy the opportunites of a player with such potential.

No, I didn't imply that Dox hadn't handled the issue. I WAS THE ONE WHO SAID THE COMMUNITY SHOULD LEAVE IT TO THE TEAM/SPONSOR TO DEAL WITH FIRST.

I have no problem with anything that happened. I just said it's not our place as the community to deal with the issue directly, and explained to chadmann who responded to that with some measure of disagreement that my process would be to contact the manager, and possibly sponsors if I felt that the issue wasn't being addressed. No part of that is meant to imply that it is not being dealt with by Dox perfectly. Deth unfortunately happened to be the example we were talking of. I have no issue with what Deth did or tried to imply that anyone should.

I don't think there is anything to address at this point. There has been a single instance of some BM, and the player even apologised to his opponent. Much respect for that.

Originally Posted by xGKingiaguz

That's bullshit Reddit logic. It's the ******* internet equivalent of A Current Affair. HEY GAIS HERE'S A NON ISSUE LET'S START WITH THE NAMING AND SHAMING.

Isn't that what this thread is? I'm saying just take it to the team and make a complaint to them rather than kicking in screaming in the forum if there is a real problem.

[PiG]

Erk.

Erasmus: Try to type a bit clearer man, it really sounded like YOU actually thought deth was a douche and you were almost threatening to go to the Nv sponsors over it.

Dox: He clarified that he was debating a point about the right way to approach the problem of unnacceptable behaviour amongst progamers, in regards to Chadman's comments.

Overall: Erasmus is basically saying who gives a crap about Deth's problem UNLESS its so disgusting that its worth contacting the sponsors over.

TL;DR: Erasmus try to express self clearer, Dox read closer. Miscommunication fail guys.

Edit: erasmus posted same time

Quick Comments

	NOM:	Deth is a douche, :P jk
	Fourby:	short and clear message is winrar. my bad yo
	FSDele:	Clarification Rep for you! sort those kids out!
	mGGAequitas:	Translator PiG to the rescue!
	Fadey:
	JoFritzMD:	PiG saving esports again

[Lyfe]

I do not try to make excuses for what I did, but I do want to reinforce the fact that as soon as i cleared my head i went straight back to the venue, shook fourbys hand, told him gg's and gave him a bro hug.

This is the first time ive done something this stupid at an event, I've literally never cracked like that at the game before, honestly don't know what came over me. Ive lost such frustrating series in offline tourneys before (4 gates from pinder, baneling busts from starhunter), and ive always taken it well in person.

I apologise once again to fourby, as well as my teammates dox and pinder for having to deal with the embarrassment of my unacceptable actions.

I will control my emotions in the future and ensure this event was a one-off.

Quick Comments

	Frogmite:
	syfChadMann:	ironic smurf name.. lol
	Fourby:	much love brother
	TACeeSerps:
	nGenLight:	Your alright buddy
	Maynarde:
	Fadey:
	NOM:	sorry i put some meth in the tonkatsu as a joke :P
	TAminimat:
	TAScarecrow:	<3
	Dox:	LOL NOM
	nirvAnA:	now this is a good and sincere apology
	TAScaramanga:
	inFeZa:	AND NOW YER BANNED. T_T but in all honesty we all <3 u and know the frustrations

[Mayo]

Originally Posted by kiP

Just my 2 cents,

I agree with Erasmus here, however I also agree with "the community site is the gateway to new sponsors." Sponsors only care about the numbers game and how much exposure they get, Idra is a perfect example of this! If there is something much more serious such as racism I guess that is when sponsors will make sure it is dealt with asap. But small shit talk like this.... seriously?

As long as the sponsored players/teams are getting that exposure, thats all the sponsors really care about... money. It really shouldn't matter that much what the community thinks about someone and how they behave.. "that much."

If anything, people love the drama. It's not exactly a bad thing. It only attracts more attention = exposure.

Hey man, sponsor here.

If PiG turned into a bantering idiot (not going to happen) I would pull his sponsorship.
There are different types of 'bad publicity' and SEA is too small to warrant any 'bad boy' antics.

I don't want to market my brand as something that supports BM behavior or banter/trolling. I am very harsh on it through all of my sponsored players/teams and it states in all contracts that BM is not acceptable.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:
	Fenner:

[inFeZa]

Originally Posted by Mayo

There are different types of 'bad publicity' and SEA is too small to warrant any 'bad boy' antics.

The business world teaches that any publicity is good publicity.
I don't necessarily agree with it, however, but many other larger scale companies do.

Quick Comments

	Mayo:
	raycey:	True that, unfortunately

[Bloodmyst]

Originally Posted by tgun

Not sure if insult or compliment

I'm just saying how things are.

I don't like to give my personal opinion at times as I generally get flamed for it. My opinion really doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things as I'm not a sponsor and am in now way shape or form affiliated with your team.

However, you calling someone a douche on a public forum is questionable considering that it's specifically coming from an "aspiring" Pro gamer. But you know what IMO, some people really are actually down right douche bags and someone needs to tell them! haha. Just not sure if it's OK coming from you "if" your aiming for that Professional appreance, which is much more "attractive" to potential teams or sponsors in future.

I know if I had a snowballs chance of becoming a Pro gamer earning a decent salary, I'd just keep my mouth shut on public forums and simply type "gg wp" at the end of each game. Even if I know inside I'd love to smack the living s^*t out of my opponent for playing such an OP race. lols.

But hey, not everyone is the same.

Quick Comments

Bash:

Respectfully stated an opinion, this is doing it right.

[Bloodmyst]

Originally Posted by Mayo

Hey man, sponsor here.

If PiG turned into a bantering idiot (not going to happen) I would pull his sponsorship.
There are different types of 'bad publicity' and SEA is too small to warrant any 'bad boy' antics.

I don't want to market my brand as something that supports BM behavior or banter/trolling. I am very harsh on it through all of my sponsored players/teams and it states in all contracts that BM is not acceptable.

Would you not sponsor a BM shit talking player who has won several major events plus consistently shows a large number of viewers on their stream each day?

I'm not sure about you, but if I was a potential sponsor... that sceams out MONEY to me. I couldn't care less how much shit talking the guy did as long as it wasn't anything serious ie. racism, drugs you get the jist. Not only to add the fact, it may be sad... but people love to watch and listen to shit talkers.

Obviously, different sponsors would look for different qualities. If you answered no to my original question, I have a feeling you would be the minority.

Let's be honest here, who would the majority of viewers rather watch? White-Ra, renowned as one of the most well mannered guys in the scene or Idra, renowned as the shit talker. Shit talking just adds to the entertainment however sad it may be.

EDIT: sorry for the double post :s

[Mayo]

As I said, SEA is too small.

You can get away with it in USA when you have 4,000 people watching a stream. But when the Aus numbers are lower (~50) there is more user interaction.

Tt eSPORTS globally does not support BM players. I mean look at SC2 pro sponsored players for us: MarineKing, White-Ra and PiG. All extremely well mannered players.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:	omg MKP IS tTe? sick
	inFeZa:	agreeeee, but we all <3 our bm n_m