[Bash]

This one time, i didnt play SEA ladder for 2 seasons so i could hit bronze & work my way up again.
I'll let you all know how that goes.

[dKiWi]

9 pylon
12 forge
14 cannon
16 cannon
18 cannon
20 cannon
21 gateway
25 core
28 stargate
29 pylon
35 fleet beacon

Standard bronze league build order.

Quick Comments

	syfChadMann:	LOL 21 gateway at 11:30 too..
	Ruski:	I agree, I beat someone who played just like this a few day ago. Was a 35 min game in the end, starved him out, he was on 2 bases.
	AxS.Sorathez:	I've seen this so many times when watching my bronze friends :P

[xxGunslingerxx]

Been said before but yeah there just aren't enough people in that 20% slot to really influence your w/l ratio significantly. If you think you played a smurf, shrug and hit the find game button stick at it and you'll be silver in no time

Quick Comments

Mayo:

Good advice!

[Johnny.L]

Smurfers are making it harder for me to get my friends into this game >.<" I always let them play around with my little brothers account and all they complain about is that they feel like they're getting better but still getting raped by people in bronze.

[TABjornbrandr]

Originally Posted by Johnny.L

Smurfers are making it harder for me to get my friends into this game >.<" I always let them play around with my little brothers account and all they complain about is that they feel like they're getting better but still getting raped by people in bronze.

That is perfectly normal. There is a huge skill difference between the top and bottom of bronze league. Top bronze is often people with a reasonable idea of what to do but without the confidence/mechanical skill to do it efficiently OR people who have no idea what to do but just make lots of shit and hit at times when you aren't ready for it.
Bronze is an odd league, it just keeps getting better afterwards, though.

[FSDarkNemesis]

And smurfers still make my life difficult just to find a Freaking WIN in the Freaking Bronze league! I'm still in Bronze 1v1....Dafug man.

[Nemo]

Originally Posted by UltimateDeep

And smurfers still make my life difficult just to find a Freaking WIN in the Freaking Bronze league! I'm still in Bronze 1v1....Dafug man.

Why your signature tells you're ?

The important thing is not your league but your level. So questions you should ask yourself:

• Are you beating 80% of the non-smurfers ?
• Are you paired with and player ?
• Are you beating 60% of s and 40% of ?

When you do that, you'll have improved enough to be promoted to . Then you will just have to be patient to play enough games at that level to be promoted. At worst, you will at the beginning of next season.

[Zealo]

And smurfers still make my life difficult just to find a Freaking WIN in the Freaking Bronze league! I'm still in Bronze 1v1....Dafug man.

this belief is incorrect. smurfers do not make it harder to win in or harder to get out of bronze league. for someone to tank their MMR they have to lose a ton. the way they do this is by losing a ton. this means that someone is winning, so someone is getting free ladder points/MMR. this 'someone' is the people in lower leagues they are smurfing in. statistically, for every smurfer that smashes you, another one deliberately lost to you.

if you can't get out of bronze league, it means at least one of two things:
a) you haven't played enough ladder games
b) you are not good enough to be in silver

blaming the existence of smurfers just makes you look as whiny (and wrong) as the people who say "i can't get out of bronze because people keep cheesing me, otherwise i'd be in gold."


sorry to single you out, your post was just a good example of the attitude that annoys me about this issue.

[Gibber]

Related... but im not saying that its extremely common or the reason why im still in lower leagues but it is disheartening.

I played 7 games a few nights about, 5 of which where smurfs. I pretty much got crushed in all five games, and looking at there season history it was, diamond+ for all of them.

Normally only get one smurfer in every 20-30 games.

[turtles]

Statistically speaking, for every smurfer who beats you shouldn't you also face a smurfer who leaves the instant the game starts?

How can you be facing so much more of one than the other?

[VB_WhiplashJC]

Smurfs? Son, there sure aren't smurfs like there used to be in my day.

Back in TT (that's Age of Mythology: The Titans for you whippersnappers), you could make as many accounts as you liked.

The ladder worked with a straight up Elo system, starting at 1600. Now, I spent the majority of my time rated around 1750, which varied a lot, because there was this thing called self-rating. When you made a new account, you could elect to self rate yourself as an expert, and it would match you with players 150 Elo points above.

Elo works on giving you points based on the difference in Elos between the players - so an average win or loss is 20 points. A loss to a self rater costs 40 points, while a win against a self rater is 5 points. That shit gets frustrating fast.

There were plenty of 1800+ players that would make a new account every time they lost their 100% wins record. There were also plenty of people using various hacks (anywhere from them appearing to resign 2 seconds in but getting the win, to spawning infinite invincible units from the campaign, to your garden variety map hack which when turned off in game caused it to go out of sync).

If you think you're playing smurfs in SC2, either they're an idiot, they got shit, or you're getting better.

[Xeen]

Same shit as we heard in BW: 'I can't get out of D because of all the smurfs!' Generally, just like in BW, it was an excuse for being bad at videogames. Shockingly enough, everyone else is trying to win, so you're not guaranteed wins in bronze - you're guaranteed to get your ass kicked until you learn how to play, and making excuses isn't helping.

Son, I rejoiced when I had a chance to play a real smurf too, because one game against that A-rank would teach me more than a dozen games with Ds.

Quick Comments

Mayo:

[Wolf_Dragunov]

well i have recently have been promoted into silver from bronze and it was a awesome feeling i havent vsed a smurf in a lng time. i was beating most of my silvers and ended up winning all of my gold match3es and i still am beating gold players in silver and ive met 3 plat beat 2 and lost 1 so im not to sure i havent seen many smurfs, i thnk just 1 and i got so angry it wasn't funny but idk i think if you can play some solid games (for eg this season i am now at a win los of 33 Wins to 10 loses so im really happy with that win loss it has showed that i have developed from what i was at the start of last season.

[Statix]

all i can say with promotion is play lots of games and as long as ur winning 50% of them ull get promoted. I was drip drapping games for best part of 6 months and feeling like i was never going to get out and then i took a holiday and hit the ladder hard, was out during that same week . . . yes, prolly 100 games later, but if ur not already subscribed get the GM manuals and literally follow the walkthrough builds and watch the replay which executes them, its just pro, believe me got me to gold in korea

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by Statix

all i can say with promotion is play lots of games and as long as ur winning 50% of them ull get promoted. I was drip drapping games for best part of 6 months and feeling like i was never going to get out and then i took a holiday and hit the ladder hard, was out during that same week . . . yes, prolly 100 games later, but if ur not already subscribed get the GM manuals and literally follow the walkthrough builds and watch the replay which executes them, its just pro, believe me got me to gold in korea

You actually need to win more than 50% - if you only win exactly 50%, your MMR will never change because you're playing at exactly the level you should be!

[TAScaramanga]

Originally Posted by breadfan

You actually need to win more than 50% - if you only win exactly 50%, your MMR will never change because you're playing at exactly the level you should be!

Yeah 50% winnrate keeps your mmr stale

[Statix]

Originally Posted by breadfan

You actually need to win more than 50% - if you only win exactly 50%, your MMR will never change because you're playing at exactly the level you should be!

I dont think MMR rating goes off just wins though and looking into this over the last year and watching my friends get promoted who have around a 50% win rate just like me are getting promoted. Just because you lost a game doesnt mean to say you are the worse player of the two in sc2 as it could have been down to a mis-rally

i think it goes off a macro Vs gametime + wins(against skill level) and then blizz calculates army values and resource collection rate . cos i swear when i was getting promoted to silver from bronze i was loosing a lot more than i was winning but still got promoted.

just to add, Apollo has done a tut series and you can clearly see his APM is way off the scale compared to a regular bronze and it started matching him against plats pretty quickly after 10 wins or so, ive had 70wins in my league and gold have only featured a few times in my matchups making me think ,yeah the wins are counted of course but i dont think they may be the rolling factor in MMR

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by Statix

I dont think MMR rating goes off just wins though and looking into this over the last year and watching my friends get promoted who have around a 50% win rate just like me are getting promoted. Just because you lost a game doesnt mean to say you are the worse player of the two in sc2 as it could have been down to a mis-rally

i think it goes off a macro Vs gametime + wins(against skill level) and then blizz calculates army values and resource collection rate . cos i swear when i was getting promoted to silver from bronze i was loosing a lot more than i was winning but still got promoted.

just to add, Apollo has done a tut series and you can clearly see his APM is way off the scale compared to a regular bronze and it started matching him against plats pretty quickly after 10 wins or so, ive had 70wins in my league and gold have only featured a few times in my matchups making me think ,yeah the wins are counted of course but i dont think they may be the rolling factor in MMR

No, it's quite literally just your win rate and the MMR of your opponents.

You might win 3 games in a row - first person has MMR 1500, the 3rd person is favoured and has an MMR of 1650. So from now on you are playing vs people at around 1650 also, so even if you maintain 50%, you end up in front of where you were originally.

Apollo got promoted that far and fast because he went 10-0, not because his APM is high. He went from beating bronze players consistently to beating silver players consistently to beating gold players consistently, etc. If you lost at any point, match making says "you can lose against these players, so this is at least close to where you belong". There's an abuse of a flaw in this system where people deliberately tank their MMR to bronze and when the next season starts, they win a quick 40 games in a row or whatever and skyrocket into GM. Not sure if it's fixed.

[TACeeSerps]

I can now officially say I played against a Rank 4 while in league and I lasted more than 10 minutes. Even if it was only part of his 5 placement matches. Yay for league and protecting against the early rush/cheese.

Who is NocturnaIsle anyways?? Is that a smurf or a genuine account?

[Johnny.L]

Lol this guy is probably getting targeted by smurfers