[NOM]

this thread..

Quick Comments

	sRDreaM:	Lol
	Nemo:	nom, nom nom ... :)

[sR_Osiris]

what no grim dont leave sR

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souljah:

are... you... kidding... me

[MooZfY]

ah they're still young, i remember i used to do alot of stupid shit when i was young. you get hit once you learn it and never do it again the end!

Quick Comments

	FSDele:	this is hit number 2.
	breadfan:	gotta be careful not to make it the norm to say "14 year olds are OK to cheat because they are 14" though

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by Shieldz

u guys should be forgiven u guys got ur punishment already meh

Quick Comments

NOM:

perfect

[OSPixel]

Everyone does something that's dumb when they are younger, stealing accounts, smurfing w/e but still, being warned already before, doing it again. then get such a tiny punishment when alot of other smurfer's i see caught get permanently banned, Smurfing is Smurfing whether its a friendly clan war or a friendly tournament!, one warning and if you get caught a second time permanent ban should be how it goes, nothing teaches you like being permenantly banned from a website you love! that's what really teaches the lesson.

[syfChadMann]

Originally Posted by FSQwerty

other smurfer's i see caught get permanently banned

where? - the only precedent was CHobo - he didn't get an indefinite ban. His was 1 year - because he was smurfing in competitions for money.

EDIT: Re comments - no CHobo got a 12 month ban from SC2SEA competitions - I *think* eddie may have given him indefinite ban from Masters Cup tho. But the SC2SEA Admins don't have power of that event - this is a ban for the individuals involved for any and all SC2SEA events (as thats the limit of the SC2SEA admin's influence) - I believe it will also result it them missing the next SEACL. Because there hasn't been other situations (besides CHobo - which was an extreme case) no set punishment was worked out - the Admins chatted about it for a few hours and decided that a short punishment and the shame it would bring is good enough for these guys - however, now everyone knows its a serious issue - and future smurfing incidents may have a harsher punishment - consider this case a warning to every other potential smurfer in the community.

Originally Posted by FSQwerty

nothing teaches you like being permenantly banned from a website you love!

That doesn't teach anything - that just stops you. GRiM gives back to the community with his help with wT Weekly. Perma bans are silly.

Quick Comments

	syfSoundwave:	Are you sure? I seem to remember CHoBo being permenantly banned, or was that just from Master's Cup?
	Bash:	he mighta got banned fter reacting poorly to people being dicks (though he deserved alot of the dick-ish comments)

[OSPixel]

Originally Posted by fray`ChadMann

That doesn't teach anything - that just stops you. GRiM gives back to the community with his help with wT Weekly. Perma bans are silly.

so its ok to cheat if you give back to the community ? Fair enough.

http://www.sc2sea.com/showthread.php?t=1208 <---- first dot point Anyone caught smurfing (signing up with multiple accounts/playing in a compeition meant for lower leage players when youre overqualified) will be instantly banned. For god's sake grow a pair and learn to compete at your own level.

now the question is to people does a clanwar count as a competition or not ? given there are no prizes

Quick Comments

	AsylumofSouls:	imo it's much worse when there are no prizes. There's not even a point to it.
	breadfan:	I missed the part where anyone said cheating was OK

[ToRPatto]

Originally Posted by ZooMforYou

ah they're still young, i remember i used to do alot of stupid shit when i was young. you get hit once you learn it and never do it again the end!

(Not directly at you Zoom) I can't really see what age has to do with it. Think it's kind of cheap to do this to your own community and it's good to see some punishment being enforced.

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ToRGreenArchon:

Age is nothing but a number :)

[pulsePsych]

Hello Guys,

This is LgNPsych (or just Psych), I just want to apologize for doing a smurf play on a clanwar (against TCP). I was asked to play and I said yes, I never thought this would happen. I know smurfing is a bad thing, but I never thought like a friendly-clanwar can be a big impact if someone smurfs, so yeah. I wanna say I'm sorry to Lemminks and to their BSG Team specifically Redux, madORyung. I made a mistake, I learned from it, and taken responsibility of my actions. I'm sorry once again to TCP, SC2SEA Admins, and Team Solarity

As for now, I'm leaving Team Solarity for good. Hopefully I can find a place to stay permanently this time.

-Psych

Quick Comments

	Akilos:	the thing is... you have the tendency to clan hop
	ToRSpartaz:	+ 1 to Titan's comment
	RicocheT:	People dont like clan hoppers
	Cube.Dione:	booo~!

[Bash]

Originally Posted by FSQwerty

so its ok to cheat if you give back to the community ? Fair enough.

http://www.sc2sea.com/showthread.php?t=1208 <---- first dot point Anyone caught smurfing (signing up with multiple accounts/playing in a compeition meant for lower leage players when youre overqualified) will be instantly banned. For god's sake grow a pair and learn to compete at your own level.

now the question is to people does a clanwar count as a competition or not ? given there are no prizes

of course its a competition, you compete for the prize of glory and bragging rights.

and permabans are dumb for alot of reasons, if we permaban people we lose good people who made mistakes, yes its a dick move but its better to persuade him to keep giving back to the community than it is to say "**** you get out", and then have people making new accounts and pretending to be someone else.

This way he has to cop it on the chin, and put up with people not trusting him and saying "screw you smurfer/cheater" , im sure theres alot of people here that simply wont trust these people again, or not for a long time, but they also get the chance to earn it back over time.

if you dont trust them/hate them for it then go ahead- no one is stopping you, thats okay and they have to put up with it, thats their punishment, but the fact they have the chance to earn it back is their motivation to be a better person, and to learn from it.

/endrant.

PS- i dont know these guys, nor was i involved at all, this is my opinion on the issue.

I do think bans should be longer, but thats obviously not my call

Quick Comments

	Antel0pe:	I'll keep what you said in mind
	NOM:	I aggree with Bash on perma bans
	FsDronesInJail:	We shall have no execution of accounts on this site!

[pXLight]

I've already posted this on Grim's blog but I'll put it here too, we (SR (Pretty much everyone but Grim and one other)) never wanted to even open up a BSG team. Just to keep the names of everyone else who was/is a part of sR clean, We had no interest in BSG and certainly not smurfing in BSG tournaments.

Quick Comments

AxS.Xenovia:

so just wanting to know, you aint blaming entire BSG brach right

[Cyanide]

Age does not absolve you from everything.

The lack of maturity, however, is evident in a few events recently. All part of the "growing up" process.

I've cheated at exams before, stolen erasers and pencils from the bookshop, nicked a few candies at the candy shop.

When you are much older, and you look back, you'll realize that it's not so much "he's just a kid', but more of 'he doesn't have the maturity to understand the consequences of such actions'.

So yeah, you get caught, accept the punishment and whatever heat that would be coming your way and move on as well as learn from it. If you are unrepentant and commit the same wrongdoings again, shame on you.

Regardless, you've learned a lesson, +0.0001 to maturing. One of many more life lessons that will shape who you are.

Quick Comments

Antel0pe:

once again, a great post. :) thanks for the input cyanide

[Shieldz]

lol i dont see a point of perm ban fsqwerty that just shows how stupid u are for wanting to perm ban if everone made a mistake and is perm banned/ never forgiven then this world wont really work properly.

Quick Comments

	OSPixel:	the more severe the punishment the less likely anyone else would do the same thing..
	breadfan:	How many murders get committed in the US each year, Qwerty, per capita? What about Aus?

[OSPixel]

I just feel the punishment should have been more severe, but i honestly do hope they "Grow" up a bit. Permanent ban from online tournaments (not lans) would of been better! but hey! nirvana is the boss and what he says goes!

/end of my rants

PS: Best of Luck to Antelope, Grim, and Psych hopefully you will learn something from this.

Quick Comments

	NOM:	**** no! Perma bans are stupid and ruin really good players
	Akilos:	Psych never learns -_-

[Antel0pe]

Originally Posted by FSQwerty

I just feel the punishment should have been more severe, but i honestly do hope they "Grow" up a bit. Permanent ban from online tournaments (not lans) would of been better! but hey! nirvana is the boss and what he says goes!

we're banned from all sc2sea tournaments, BSG, PD, wT Weekly Master Cup. Re-read the OP post please

Quick Comments

OSPixel:

i did read it, said you were banned for 3 months. small punishment in my opinion

[Antel0pe]

Originally Posted by sRAntelope

i did read it, said you were banned for 3 months. small punishment in my opinion

so do I, but I can't go begging for more punishment, yeh? I trust the sc2sea admins enough that they made the right decision for us.

[sRDante]

Originally Posted by sReKol

I've already posted this on Grim's blog but I'll put it here too, we (SR (Pretty much everyone but Grim and one other)) never wanted to even open up a BSG team. Just to keep the names of everyone else who was/is a part of sR clean, We had no interest in BSG and certainly not smurfing in BSG tournaments.

A lot (not all) of the original sR members disagreed to open this BSG section, reason being that some don't want a chatroom full of people asking for teamgames etc... Grim was being persistent with the bsg idea, thinking it would be a good transition to vN, and decided to create the division in the hands of antelope. The deal was we will limit the communication between the bsg division, but slowly things went out of hand as we were responsible to train and coach the bsg division. What I'm trying to say is that all this BSG smurfing really has nothing affiliated with the original sR team (excluding our leader...), I know it was still the same clan, but as eKol said, none of us payed interest to it, and knew nothing much about it. So please, I really don't want sR to die to the hands of a couple of shameful smurfers, the skype, the community overall made me view the game differently. Hate the player, don't hate the clan. >.< bigbootybitches.

Quick Comments

pXLight:

Way to 'out-post' me you ass :P

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by FSQwerty

so its ok to cheat if you give back to the community ? Fair enough.

http://www.sc2sea.com/showthread.php?t=1208 <---- first dot point Anyone caught smurfing (signing up with multiple accounts/playing in a compeition meant for lower leage players when youre overqualified) will be instantly banned. For god's sake grow a pair and learn to compete at your own level.

now the question is to people does a clanwar count as a competition or not ? given there are no prizes

He gave back to the community(and will still be giving back) before this smurfing incident. Your argument is invalid. Bye bye.

P.S. The punishment is reasonable considering it was just a small-scale "competition".

Quick Comments

OSPixel:

i did mean if you give to the community before getting caught cheating. not give to the community after btw.

[nirvAnA]

Just to add some perspective on the punishment not being "permanent"... yet.

Punishment should aim to accomplish two things:

1. Send a clear message this type of behaviour is wrong
2. Discourage such behaviour in future from others

Punishment should not:

1. Be so harsh to remove people from the clan, destroy a clan, force a player into retirement etc. The point is not to destroy/remove the offender/clan it is to correct their behaviour and discourage such behaviour.
2. This is not the same as chobo/seohyeon's punishment. As nemo said they were thieves. sR were doing dodgy shit but in a friendly clan war.

Obviously when its clear that the person is not going to repent, only then we talk about "permanent" and "indefinite" bans. In most cases such as forum bans, many chances are given first. That is the way it has always been, I think its reasonable enough. However, smurfing in lower league competitions especially is a very serious issue. We need to protect the spirit of fair competition and we cannot afford to be lenient there as such behaviour is detrimental to the whole scene and cannot be tolerated.

With that being said, there is also no need to go overboard. There is no need to jump ahead to the next stage and administer a punishment too serve such as an indefinite ban for now. And yea the message has already been sent and people should now be well aware of the consequences. Repeat offenders will be severely dealt with, permanently.

Quick Comments

	OSPixel:	Well said, thanks for that nirv!
	Antel0pe:	thanks for clearing things up Nirv
	Bash:	tyty
	Cube.Dione:	Well said.

[AxS.Xenovia]

Originally Posted by sRDante

A lot (not all) of the original sR members disagreed to open this BSG section, reason being that some don't want a chatroom full of people asking for teamgames etc... Grim was being persistent with the bsg idea, thinking it would be a good transition to vN, and decided to create the division in the hands of antelope. The deal was we will limit the communication between the bsg division, but slowly things went out of hand as we were responsible to train and coach the bsg division. What I'm trying to say is that all this BSG smurfing really has nothing affiliated with the original sR team (excluding our leader...), I know it was still the same clan, but as eKol said, none of us payed interest to it, and knew nothing much about it. So please, I really don't want sR to die to the hands of a couple of shameful smurfers, the skype, the community overall made me view the game differently. Hate the player, don't hate the clan. >.< bigbootybitches.

im taking your post as "the main sR group got nothing, its all BSG fault" sorry if im interpreting it wrong but thats what it sounds like
you guys kept your deal. there was minimal communication with you guys, we only asked small questions and stuff. nothing major like coaching or any of that. im taking your post as "the main sR group got nothing with this, its all BSG fault" sorry if im interpreting it wrong but seriously? "Slowly out of hand"? so us talking to ourselves, and hell if know , no-one but Ante had any of your skypes that i know of. even if we did, im sure nothing came down to "lets ask ___ about what time this that" (once again this is to my knowledge so i may be wrong). I remember asking dream to play a monobattle ONCE with SouL and Ninja. oh and talking to GRiM for a review on my replay for cw vs FS. like hell you guys did training and coaching. I suggested to the BSG on skype lets to do this and that on sc2.(which we enver did lol) didnt hear any bull about "___ is gna coach you guys" i heard GRiM say it once. and ONCE.

never got any contact from anyone else about that matter. so please. dont say stuff like that.

(I acknowledge that i may be wrong in some cases but this is from my view point whilest in the BSG led by Ante)

Quick Comments

Antel0pe:

exactly what I wanted to say ekol