[ToRMaverick]

TRUSTY this is bloody awsome. I would rep train you forever but I cant give you any till i share it round (I should just so I can rep you again).

It all makes perfect sence and at this point I fit into "player B" catagory. I am taking this on board as of right now and implimenting it for season 6.

I seriously want you as my mentour. Awsome stuff!

[Trusty]

Originally Posted by ToRMaverick

TRUSTY this is bloody awsome. I would rep train you forever but I cant give you any till i share it round (I should just so I can rep you again).

It all makes perfect sence and at this point I fit into "player B" catagory. I am taking this on board as of right now and implimenting it for season 6.

I seriously want you as my mentour. Awsome stuff!

Yeah I'm happy to, I'll update the other thread.

I used to be "player B" as well, I think everyone was at some point.

[FS.Kezz]

Long time lurker, first proper post - hey all! [ ]

I've only recently ventured into laddering and from what I've gathered from various sources, the messages in this thread are spot on - you can go from bronze to at least gold with just 1 build per matchup, if you work on nailing the macro every single time.

My question is, what are solid builds that I could use against each race? So far, I've just got a Marine/Marauder opening that transitions into Marine/Tank after the initial push at ~50 supply. I'm using it in every matchup and my success/failure is always dependent on whether or not I nail the macro.

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by 'kezz.,

Long time lurker, first proper post - hey all! [ ]

I've only recently ventured into laddering and from what I've gathered from various sources, the messages in this thread are spot on - you can go from bronze to at least gold with just 1 build per matchup, if you work on nailing the macro every single time.

My question is, what are solid builds that I could use against each race? So far, I've just got a Marine/Marauder opening that transitions into Marine/Tank after the initial push at ~50 supply. I'm using it in every matchup and my success/failure is always dependent on whether or not I nail the macro.

That's a bit of a tech deviation to go from marauders to tanks (all the gas that went to marauders could be going to an earlier factory and more tanks)

Marauders are awesome vs protoss (the place of tanks is in the early game as part of a 111).

Here are some that I'm either using now, or helped me a lot until recently

TvT ThorZaiN's marine tank (Day[9] Daily #394)
TvZ ThorZaiN's marine drop (Day[9] daily #402)
TvP anyone's standard MMM with ghosts later

Timing attacks:
TvT 111 tank viking or 111 hellion/marine elevator
TvZ 111 hellion/marine elevator or marauder hellion
TvP 111 banshee all in

try http://audiobuilds.com for the timing attacks

Would be very interested in hearing other tiimings (there are just so many macro options available, it's easy to come up with one to work on)

[uoeahtns]

Originally Posted by 'kezz.,

My question is, what are solid builds that I could use against each race? So far, I've just got a Marine/Marauder opening that transitions into Marine/Tank after the initial push at ~50 supply. I'm using it in every matchup and my success/failure is always dependent on whether or not I nail the macro.

A build that I have been using for each matchup is the 1 rax expo. However, the part after the command center changes for different matchups.

For example, for TvP, I will add 3 extra raxes quickly after i get my command center but delay my gases so I will have enough marines to hold off rushes such as the 4 gate.

For TvZ, I will get gases around 21 and essentially do a delayed hellion opener while transitioning into marine/tank/medivac with a quick third.

For TvT, I will do a delayed 1/1/1, getting both gases at 19 and getting a viking out asap, followed by a raven if the banshee comes, medivacs if it doesn't. (this works because the time spent getting the cc is made up by the distance from his starport to your base) If your opponent does a marine/tank all in you will have to abuse the high ground in order to hold him off. The trickiest build to hold off with this is the 1/1/1, as his will be faster than yours, but don't be afraid to pile on the bunkers, as you will have extra money from mules. The bunkers will either delay his push and give you time to catch up on army or make your defenses much stronger when he pushes out.

I gave a lot more information for the TvT variation I use, but that is because pulling it off in TvT is a lot tighter than TvP or TvZ as you have to defend slightly beyond the logic; If he rushes, build bunkers.

Anyway, the build goes;
10 depot, 12 rax, 15 oc, 16 depot, the usual
around 18-19 supply, with constant marine/scv production, lay down your cc when you can afford it.
The build varies from there.

Quick Comments

FS.Kezz:

thanks :)

[uoeahtns]

I do not think you need to have a repertoire to pick from on ladder. You play against a different person each time, there is no reason to switch up your builds.

I think that it would be best to learn builds for each matchup one at a time. No matter the skill level, this is the right way to go about learning builds. Of course, it would be a good idea to revisit old builds that you have already learned just to refresh your memory or something of the like, but having a focus on learning one thing a time makes things go so much faster.

[Stokez]

Just 1 build.

Just remember quality over quantity!

[EveLoire]

Originally Posted by breadfan

My concern is, I don't know an effective all in for TvZ! I mean, I guess I could 11/11 rax, or do a marauder hellion timing. Is there a better option?

Personally, i feel that all-ins don't help you improve much, not as much as macro games anyway

[rezyn8]

Some good points bread, but what happens with the all-in afterwards, how do you expand on an all-in strategy if the game goes into the mid or even late game? What happens when you get into plat or diamond+ and these all in strategies are no longer viable? Are you willing to give up good game sense in 66% of match-ups for the sake of quickly leveling up only to end up losing more in the higher leagues because you do not have a solid opening for these match-ups?

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by rezyn8

Some good points bread, but what happens with the all-in afterwards, how do you expand on an all-in strategy if the game goes into the mid or even late game? What happens when you get into plat or diamond+ and these all in strategies are no longer viable? Are you willing to give up good game sense in 66% of match-ups for the sake of quickly leveling up only to end up losing more in the higher leagues because you do not have a solid opening for these match-ups?

You don't, that's why it's called an all-in. If you don't win with it, you lose (unless you both end up with 5 workers left at the end)

I think you need to re-read Trusty's advice - he didn't say that you should pick 2 matchups to all-in against all the way to GM, and only ever macro in the other.

Also, all in strategies are always viable in higher leagues, whether it be GM or GSL.

I truly appreciate the feedback just as much as anyone else, but what you're saying really disagrees with my own personal experience in a big way, as well as the advice from GMs whose own personal experience probably eclipses both of ours combined.

[FS.Kezz]

Thanks guys, I'll take all of that into my game and see where it takes me

[ToRPandarine]

shit...i just read all the posts and hv no clue what everyone is sayin...

+ ["sad panda] +

depends...im sure you've seen me play or sumtin but i hv only 3 builds, 1 for each race

TvP - A little something something Snod gave me a cool idea to do where i get a Reaper around 16/17, keep it alive, get 2 Rauders with conc and go give the Brotoss a little whirl :3

TvZ - Reactor Hellion Expand...what else would u do? :P

TvT - 1/1/1 When I do this build, I just become a paranoid panda. I try to keep the XNT, scout, scan, you name it

I've more or less spammed these 3 builds that I can afford every 10 games or so I muck about to see if I can pull off something else eg. 3Reaper Expand (Fail) or try crap I think off eg. 3Rax 1Lab 1Reactor

timings? IDK cause im still a chobo and stuck in :P but, generally some common timings i guess are

expand every 6-8 mins, push when you get a major upgrade eg stim, attk, siege, push when you have a certain no of units eg. 3 tanks, 3 reapers, always expand whn pushing or even poking alittle...and thts as much as i can think of my head

[Trusty]

Originally Posted by ThePandarine

shit...i just read all the posts and hv no clue what everyone is sayin...

+ ["sad panda] +

depends...im sure you've seen me play or sumtin but i hv only 3 builds, 1 for each race

TvP - A little something something Snod gave me a cool idea to do where i get a Reaper around 16/17, keep it alive, get 2 Rauders with conc and go give the Brotoss a little whirl :3

TvZ - Reactor Hellion Expand...what else would u do? :P

TvT - 1/1/1 When I do this build, I just become a paranoid panda. I try to keep the XNT, scout, scan, you name it

I've more or less spammed these 3 builds that I can afford every 10 games or so I muck about to see if I can pull off something else eg. 3Reaper Expand (Fail) or try crap I think off eg. 3Rax 1Lab 1Reactor

timings? IDK cause im still a chobo and stuck in :P but, generally some common timings i guess are

expand every 6-8 mins, push when you get a major upgrade eg stim, attk, siege, push when you have a certain no of units eg. 3 tanks, 3 reapers, always expand whn pushing or even poking alittle...and thts as much as i can think of my head

I'm no terran, but I guess 3rax Stim would be a good one to learn for TvP. 1-1-1 is a bit harder, so I'd do that afterwards.