[okokitroll]

and also.

i have not been paid for doing an event since 2008. if you were actually at SCAPE, and if you look at our booth there, the whole thing was either sponsored or it came out of our own pockets. neither have i been paid for doing casting either. EPIC gave me 5 bucks to take a cab back though.

[FatHuntresS]

2 , if its not idra thrash talking down the players dont even bother. its not funny. and its disrespectful

[Mezza]

Dear All, before any other further flaming or berating comes along, take some time to read Carzydog Ken's post on the round1.sg forums because its a well written and fair take on the whole situation.

http://www.round1.sg/forums/index.php?topic=1703.15

Next, I'm appealing to everyone in the community, SC2 and SF alike to not stoke any fires by not posting anything which may deem as a personal attack, or insult or just state any personal agenda (ie. social awkwardness/gender issues, etc. should all go out of the window, because they were not part of the issue in the opening post).

Everyone's passionate about the game and community which they come from, and views will inherently be biased, and therefore comments and criticism may oftentimes be taken a little to far.

I, in a previous post of this thread, admittedly responded very harshly when I heard of HD's comments and after gaining some perspective and background information, understand where the SF4 casters are coming from. If I have offended anyone with those statements, I apologize for it, and have already retracted them.

However, the point for this thread is in the opening post, which I believe most people have failed to read. It was directed at the 2 following issues.

SF4 casters were
1. Making fun of the losers who were relegated to the losers brackets
2. Ragging the guys who got a bye

These 2 issues here isn't just trash talking imho. Trash talking in itself is such a loosely defined term, casters doing it to drum up support for an underdog or crowd favourite, players doing it for showmanship, etc.

Now please understand where HD is coming from. He's a neutral fan, and he's not happy about it, and he's objectively asking people is it just him or does the community condone this as a whole.

Personally, I don't see it as hate (which is what the round1.sg forum thread title stated HD's thread as), but for people who actually care about the community, this is feedback. HD's a neutral fan, (as are the majority of the people here on this forum) and if he's turned off by something in the commentary, he's making it known. True, things that he feels are uncalled for may truly be unique to the SF4 scene and are deemed socially acceptable, but the fact is you've got a window of insight into a thinking neutral fan's mind, and that's awesome because he's giving constructive feedback, instead of just straight out flaming the SF4 casters.

So everyone involved in this, take a step back and put stuff back in perspective, because flaming doesn't do anyone any good and at the end of the day, both SC2 and SF4 communities only stand to lose if there's animosity between the two.

I've also moderated the thread by taking out the outright flaming, such as threads which have a long paragraph of quotes and a one liner flame. These were neither constructive, nor needed. To the users involved, please refrain from posting such things in future.

To the SF4 community and shoutcasters, I hope you'll take HD's initial comments as well as my thoughts on the neutral fans into account. As for everything else that's being said in a cast and how acceptable it is, only you guys can be the true judge of that because no one else knows the scene better than you guys.

Long post, I know, but stuff just needed to be said.

[kellyMILKIES]

Hey guys. What's up omg. Haven't been to the forum in like 3 days. Except when I was showing it on the screen at GFS.
Anyway it's already over. We are different community and I know that the way the other 2 casters style of casting is because of the community.

SC2 is a more serious community so of course my style of casting is different. SF4 is a game that even 0.25seconds make a difference as we could see in the ULTRA-ULTRA loserbrackets finals on the stage so maybe they needed that style of casting.

I understand the points raised during the replies of this tread.
I read the tread on the round1.sg forums,
First of all, tread title> Some HATE by the sc2 community?
I think what's happening is that you have to ultimately understand that besides your sc4 community, other people are listening to you cast also. In fact, EVERYONE in the hall. So maybe "Bugis is used to this kind of commentary", well I don't want to be harsh but you are at a big / official event. It's not Bugis. XL style is acceptable in arcade environment, but might not be received well at events where Sponsors and Organisers are there, and the image potrayed to the people who are not in the community might not be right. You need to understand that to cast at big / official events, professionalism is important.

Secondly. " Is it truly a crime that people can’t accept beratements, sexism and racism jokes?"
Yes. It is a crime. People get sued for it left right center everywhere, all the time. But I'm not saying you were being extremely harsh or sexist nor racist towards me. I'm just saying.

Thirdly > "It’s not personal, but as I read some of the responses to these threads, but I can only express my solemn disappointment and anger at the points about how we shouldn’t give a **** about how others think and that how people do not have the right to criticize for various reasons (e.g. internet warriors, don’t dare to show up IRL, an apparent general lack of understanding about the SF4 community)".
Your listeners and people who watch your casting in fact ANYONE who hears you cast HAVE a right to give you a feedback. Don't take it as if it's criticism. I got a fair share of "feedback" back when I first casted, even till today. Your reply to this is just... not helping. It shows how you are unwilling to accept that fact that there are different. "Diversity" remember? If you want diversity casters, you will get diversity listeners / spectators.


Sigh. I have heard SF4 Casting in America, Japan etc. And I have heard Singapore casting.
It's not that I have something against the Casters. They were great in their ENTHU way.
But the reply and reaction to this post and making it sound as if the SC2 Community is trying to pick a fight with the SF4 Community is just not the right way to react.
SC2 and SF4 are both Single Player games. Surely you understand the climb to the top, however glorified, is still long and "lonesome".
Feedbacks are ultimately "Not personal". It's just a feedback to how we can work together better in future events if any, and how you can improve.
Imma be working together with xian, your top sf4 player soon. There is no hate from me to the SF4 community. None at all.

I might not even know what I'm saying. GOODDAY AND GOODBYE.

[okokitroll]

post edited because it was directly targeted at me (and perhaps HD).

in general if you've got something to tell someone directly, PM would be a great option.

-mezza

[tyco_kia]

Hi guys, if I may, I speak on behalf of SG's SF4 community and our 2 commentators, Jon and VX. I'm one of the moderators at Round1, I just want to clear up everything here.

From this thread alone, it seems that there were pockets of people who were disturbed by the way they commentated and on behalf of our community, once more we humbly apologise for any offensive comments made and if we offended anyone.

It is never their intention to abuse, put down, flame or any of that sort any player. Yes their commentary causes people to feel awkward and are at times socially unacceptable to a certain extent but it's all in good fun. I strongly urge those who attended the event to take their comments with a pinch of salt, really.

It is strange but our community simply love the way they commentate, we've had our fair share of commentators who went about doing their job perhaps in a manner that is deemed acceptable by the neutral fan. It was normal, clean and decent but it certainly didn't get us hyped the way Jon and VX do.

Most of our SF4 events to date are held in private space or closed doors whereby our commentary is not usually made heard throughout an entire event. As a result, other gaming communities were exposed to their style of commentary which inevitably developed some detractors and opinions.

I'm very sorry to say this to the neutral fans but the SF4 community will want these 2 to continue the way they commentate because we totally buy it.

Honestly speaking, there's no style of commentary that will suit the needs of everyone. We all have our different opinions, Jon and VX will never be able to please everyone. They like what they are doing, the community buys what they commentate, ít works for us, it's that simple.

In short, Jon and VX made people sit up and listen to them, that is their style of commentary. This of course will lead to likes and dislikes, positive and negative feedback but it certainly generated interest into what they were talking about which in turn is hype itself.

There are of course 2 sides of the coin to this, hence we've arrived at this thread but we're all making an effort to clear the air and address the situation with opinions and thoughts from both camps.

We're all gamers, there's absolutely no animosity between the 2 communities I can assure you. We respect what you guys are doing and we only wish for the same from your end.

Once again, thank you for your feedback! I hope this clears up everything and we hope to see you guys at our events, we'll also attend SC2 events whenever possible as a show of support for the local gaming scene.

Cheers everyone! =)

[kellyMILKIES]

Cheers guys.

[Mezza]

And on those bombshells, I shall close the thread to reciprocate. Both communities, take whatever you want away from it, but remember this

"Make love, not war."
-John Lennon

+year 2010 message "use protection"

update - I didn't actually close the thread, someone else beat me to it, but nevermind.