[Strafe]

If you can find such an instance again you can rule out any chance of him not hacking. Right now it seems likely you guys caught yourself a big hacking fish. It does explain why he wasn't able to beat platinum league one day and then suddenly own it up in GM in a time span of 2 months or so. Let's wait for Chobo's side of the story though. Maybe he can make a sensible explanation for all of this. It does start to look grim for him.

I am still secretly hoping he doesn't hack, because it will be a sad day for competitive gaming. Not only would Mafia have been denied a victory and his prize money, but also all the players like Targa, Enderrr, Yang who he took out on his side of the bracket were unfairly affected by this. The Master Cup is a great event and I hope it's here to stay, but maphackers are an issue in any online event. If Chobo is indeed confirmed as a maphacker then I hope the organizers of the Master Cup will ban him indefinitely from participating and obviously not pay him his prize money. I personally don't think it should be awarded to Mafia either as Targa/Enderr/Yang also didn't get a shot to compete for it, because of him. So instead I'd like to see the prize money to be added as a bonus to the next event.

Still let's hope he didn't actually hack

Quick Comments

Dox:

your posts are few, but wise

[iM yang]

Originally Posted by Strafe

Yang who he took out on his side of the bracket were unfairly affected by this. The Master Cup is a great event and I hope it's here to stay, but maphackers are an issue in any online event.

our games were straight up and he beat me fair & square, unsure about targa/enderr games tho

Quick Comments

	FvRphoneheha:	Nice of you to say that :)
	nirvAnA:
	xGKingdelete:
	CHoBo(kice):	yes sir. g2 was close

[Rage]

I certainly hope that the masters cup prize money will at least be put on hold until this is sorted out.

[ToR.Arnor]

Originally Posted by Rage

I certainly hope that the masters cup prize money will at least be put on hold until this is sorted out.

knowing how awesome Eddie is, he probably already sent out the winnings

[CHoBo(kice)]

This post I will be continually updating with answers to previous posts. I will not answer anything beyond this point because it will just go on forever.

I am going to work my way from most recent post back words.

sc2gears analysis - I am not sure of the integrity of this tool. I am sure with constant updates/bug fixes... This could be a bug.

the reason why I didn't want to write responses to allegations was because I don't hack and thought most would realise this by watching replays. But it has gone viral in the opposite direction and sadly I have to spend my precious time defending myself now.

[NvPinder]

sc2gears thing is wrong 100%, im pretty sure sc2gears reads exactly from the replay, so there is no way to prove it in sc2gears that there isnt in the sc2 replay itself (if he selects a building he cant see, if sc2gears is showing he has it selected, it will show he has it selected in the game too).

Unfortunately as people have said, with hacking technology the way it is today you cannot prove map hacking beyond 0 doubt, the hacks are too good and it's practically impossible to prove past the obvious. Him taking a different path with vikings to snipe overlords out on the map every game but hitting every overlord perfectly, pathing perfectly to pylons, building walls when he needs them and not lifting them when he doesn't and having his screen lock for a decent amount of time when players are usually playing incredibly quickly is about the most evidence you're ever going to get.

Everything else will always be circumstantial and just like the counter-strike community, the only way to be sure the tournament has 100% legitimacy is to play at LAN. Hence why online counter-strike 1.6 tournaments were laughable and have been practically pointless for a long time now. No one cares because anyone can cheat and get away with it with relative ease to the point where everyone does cheat because why the **** not.

[x5_Bard]

UHF has listed the correct parsing in his post, Rossi's is in the wrong time ^^

The only thing that SC2gears can conclude is that Chobo watched his ramp with his camera unmoving for ~20 seconds performing no actions. While this sounds suspicious it could be for any number of innocent reasons. Also I dont think his camera is locked at all, he just looks AFK lol

That being said I feel that there is enough evidence in the mafia games. Its blatantly obvious that something weird is going on.

Quick Comments

mGGAequitas:

take a sip of water = HACKER!!!

[RicocheT]

Originally Posted by Bard

The only thing that SC2gears can conclude is that Chobo watched his ramp with his camera unmoving for ~20 seconds performing no actions. While this sounds suspicious it could be for any number of innocent reasons. Also I dont think his camera is locked at all, he just looks AFK lol

Why would you go AFK in a masters cup game? You're playing for money! If I was playing in the masters cup, I would be spamming like a mofo (partly to look good in case they check EPM/APM, but also so my fingers are fully warmed up for epic micro battles to come). Plus in 20 seconds, you have a lot to do. Supply depots, moar marinez, moar rax, moar scvs, etc. You can't just simply afk 20 seconds in a masters cup game, especially against Peleus (props to Bard for the correction)

I personally haven't analysed the replays so I won't comment on the rest of it.

Edit: My bad Bard D=

Quick Comments

x5_Bard:

The game was not against mafia it was vs peleus.

[NvPinder]

Originally Posted by FaDeUndoNe

Why would you go AFK in a masters cup game? You're playing for money! If I was playing in the masters cup, I would be spamming like a mofo (partly to look good in case they check EPM/APM, but also so my fingers are fully warmed up for epic micro battles to come). Plus in 20 seconds, you have a lot to do. Supply depots, moar marinez, moar rax, moar scvs, etc. You can't just simply afk 20 seconds in a masters cup game, especially against Mafia.

I personally haven't analysed the replays so I won't comment on the rest of it.

To be honest I find the parts of replays where he 'screen locks' for 1-3 seconds much more sus than 20 seconds.

You'd never do nothing for 20 seconds unless you were afk, it doesnt take you 20 seconds of staring off camara to figure out what your opponent is doing, whens the last time you saw a terran player look at what he scanned for more than half a second? Players playing at this level have seen everything that can be seen in the game 1,000 times over, we don't sit there scratching our chins deducing what every building is then deciding our next plan of action while doing it.

I'd say 99% chance hes afk/answering the phone/accidentally alt tabbed or something here.

[Peleus]

Originally Posted by FaDeUndoNe

Why would you go AFK in a masters cup game? You're playing for money! If I was playing in the masters cup, I would be spamming like a mofo (partly to look good in case they check EPM/APM, but also so my fingers are fully warmed up for epic micro battles to come). Plus in 20 seconds, you have a lot to do. Supply depots, moar marinez, moar rax, moar scvs, etc. You can't just simply afk 20 seconds in a masters cup game, especially against Mafia.

I personally haven't analysed the replays so I won't comment on the rest of it.

To make it clear, this was not a MC game, it was 15 minutes beforehand in a ladder game.

I agree that the sc2gears thing is 'irrelevant' in the sense of matching actions as the time in the original is wrongly correlated to in game time, although I too was fooled to begin with so I'm not blaming anyone for the misunderstanding. On one side it points out the dangers (that I am also susceptible too) of being in a 'hack' mind frame and jumping to that conclusion whenever you see something amiss. On the flip side one mistake doesn't nullify the other questionable actions that have been made and need to be explained.

Considering that sc2gears simply parses the information from the replay file, and the replay you view is the sc2 engine reconstructing the game from the command lines in these files it would be extremely unusual / impossible for something to be in sc2gears that isn't in the replay also. (Once more, not pointing fingers or sounding like I know it all, I was wrong at the start too).

Quick Comments

RicocheT:

Aight, thanks for clarifying =]

[CHoBo(kice)]

My response to Quote 1:

The reason for the pausing / AFK

I had hay fever... I sneezed all over keyboard and shit.... it was for valid reason

For Quote 2

The ling, festor is a much popular style in Korea and in general opposed to the ling,bane muta.

Although I believed I knew mafia's style really well... I was actually scared that game when I was constantly scanning. In case he did something crazy

Edit: I do alt-tab frequently also because my gf msgs me on fb even thought she knows im playing :/

Quick Comments

x5_Bard:

lol you didnt actually ask a question, just made some weird statement

[NvPinder]

Originally Posted by AsGCHoBo

My response to Quote 1:

The reason for the pausing / AFK

I had hay fever... I sneezed all over keyboard and shit.... it was for valid reason

For Quote 2

The ling, festor is a much popular style in Korea and in general opposed to the ling,bane muta.

Although I believed I knew mafia's style really well... I was actually scared that game when I was constantly scanning. In case he did something crazy

Edit: I do alt-tab frequently also because my gf msgs me on fb even thought she knows im playing :/

Only if your girlfriend was AT LEAST a 9 would you bother to consistently alt tab that much through the majority of games you play in for a girl I'm assuming you've already had sex with. The only way for you to verify this would be half, if not full naked pictures of your girlfriend for us to discuss the legitimacy of her attractiveness and deem if she is worthy of this amount of alt tabbing.

Quick Comments

	inFeZa:	Best post in this thread.
	Stallion:	LOL hahahahahahahaha well played
	iM tgun:	Second.
	ROCCAT_Savior:
	Zealo:
	Dox:
	Trinion:
	Strafe:
	TABiggun:	Yes
	deL:
	fray`Alpha:

[TABiggun]

Although some evidence was incorrect, there is still the suspicious and random 'look' chobo did at mafia's main at 5:30 in the Shakuras game. And also an explanation of why someone plays completely blind then the only two game where there is a spire, Chobo decides to scan the main. Of course, there are many questionable things but I would say these are some which need some explaining.

These are the two biggest concerns for me and I fully explain the situation in my previous post at the bottom of page 27.

[Rage]

I'm not convinced.

I'd rather see a thousand guilty maphackers go unpunished than see us attack an innocent person - and we can never be sure.

Quick Comments

AxSGRiM:

how do you know hes innocent

[nirvAnA]

I have added a note to Rossi's original "concrete evidence" log post, so people new to this thread do not get the wrong idea. This is why checks need to be extremely thorough before such accusations are made. A lot of people, myself included were misled by this and thought chobo was a confirmed hacker, when in reality, there was an error in the sc2gears time with blizzard time and game time not being aligned properly in the replay. This was verified by paperclip as well.

The correct log posted by UHF is in this post and indications no actions at all http://www.sc2sea.com/showpost.php?p...&postcount=571

Lesson learned: don't be so quick to judge, take time make sure the method is 100% full proof before making such an accusation.

9:20 Peleus Deselect 3 units
9:21 AsGCHoBo Select Marine x4 (10290,102a0,40310,70384), Deselect all
9:21 AsGCHoBo Right click; target: x=51.3,y=127.0
9:21 Peleus Right click; target: Extractor (103f8)
9:21 AsGCHoBo Right click; target: x=51.5,y=126.2
9:21 AsGCHoBo Right click; target: x=51.7,y=126.0
9:21 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:21 Peleus Select Larva x4 (203e0,103e8,103f0,10400), Deselect all
9:21 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:21 Peleus Select Larva x4 (203e0,103e8,103f0,10400), Deselect all
9:22 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:22 Peleus Select Larva x4 (203e0,103e8,103f0,10400), Deselect all
9:22 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:22 Peleus Select Larva x4 (203e0,103e8,103f0,10400), Deselect all
9:22 Peleus Train Zergling
9:22 Peleus Train Zergling
9:23 Peleus Train Zergling
9:23 Peleus Select Egg (203e0), Deselect 1 unit
9:23 Peleus Train Zergling
9:23 Peleus Select Egg (103e8), Deselect 2 units
9:23 Peleus Train Zergling
9:23 Peleus Select Egg (103f0), Deselect 3 units
9:23 Peleus Train Zergling
9:23 Peleus Select Egg (10400), Deselect 4 units
9:24 Peleus Select Drone x5 (40274,902f0,30328,2038c,203c8), Deselect all
9:25 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:26 Peleus Select Drone x14 (402f8,40308,b032c,50338,70358,10364,9036c,3037c,2 0394,20398,203a4,103bc,203c0,203d0), Deselect all
9:27 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:31 Peleus Hotkey Select 1
9:31 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:32 Peleus Select Queen (20298), Deselect all
9:33 Peleus Spawn Larva (Queen); target: Hatchery (101fc)
9:33 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:34 Peleus Select Larva x4 (100300,1041c,10424,1042c), Deselect all
9:34 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:34 Peleus Select Larva x4 (100300,1041c,10424,1042c), Deselect all
9:34 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:34 Peleus Select Larva x5 (100300,1041c,20420,10424,1042c), Deselect all
9:34 Peleus Hotkey Select 4
9:34 Peleus Select Larva x5 (100300,1041c,20420,10424,1042c), Deselect all
9:35 Peleus Train Zergling
9:35 Peleus Train Zergling
9:35 Peleus Train Zergling
9:35 Peleus Select Egg (100300), Deselect 1 unit
9:35 Peleus Train Zergling
9:35 Peleus Select Egg (1041c), Deselect 2 units
9:35 Peleus Train Zergling
9:35 Peleus Select Egg (20420), Deselect 3 units
9:35 Peleus Train Zergling
9:35 Peleus Select Egg (10424), Deselect 4 units
9:36 Peleus Train Zergling
9:36 Peleus Select Egg (1042c), Deselect 5 units
9:36 Peleus Select Queen (2030c), Deselect all
9:39 AsGCHoBo Hotkey Select 1
9:39 AsGCHoBo Train Marine
9:39 AsGCHoBo Train Marine
9:39 AsGCHoBo Train Marine
9:39 AsGCHoBo Hotkey Select 2

The actions corroborate exactly with the replay. No actions made. ALT-tab? Gf called? screen lock? who knows it just isn't conclusive at all.

[Spud]

Scans in game 1 vs mafia at 15minutes to reveal greater spire are hilarious. (only scan till that point)
Chobo u are a dirty fking c.u.n.t

Yang why keep it clean.
This dickbag is winning money and ruining the game to prop up his own fked ego.
I dont know why u are all defending him.
This should be an execution not a gay discussion

Quick Comments

	iM yang:	keep it clean champ
	mGGDaedalus:	contribute or stop cluttering the thread
	Uglymutt:	Contributes nothing
	iM MaFia:	HAHAHAHHA
	ROOTPetraeus:	wtf mafia
	Snx.FigJig:	no
	Strafe:	Since when do we execute on a strong suspicion without hearing the other side first?
	Dox:	rep is really serious and important
	RicocheT:	I dont see how you justified yourself just there mate...
	ToR.Arnor:	calm down man, im happy your back, but cool your heals T_T
	neKo:	Oh god my sides
	mGGAequitas:	after reading all the evidence in this post I must say th.... oh wait...
	syfCabracan:	This is the capital punishment of starcraft, treat it more seriously please.
	deL:	SHOOT FIRST ASK QUESTIONS LATER

[Stallion]

Hay guys could someone who plays terran at a high level like rossi, iaguz, yoon make a list of the timings that terran needs to scout in tvz for things like fast muta/roach bling all in etc and can chobo answer how he scouted or knew about them? I don't think we should automatically condemn him for a few screen locks. I mean sure its suss but maybe he alt tabbed or something. I also don't have much experience in playing chobo but from what i understand he is a fairly cheese/unorthodox player so some of his random scouting paths may have a reason from him as to why he does it. If you do have a reason for these Chobo could you simply explian them? I'd hate to condemn someone who is innocent

[TargA]

nirvana, how about you stop defending this **** and instead get him banned from all tournaments?

He has other trends in his play as well, everytime he is about to pull scvs he sends them to opponents main mineral line, and then has his camera there for a few seconds.

His micro is absolutely trash, his decision making is the sickest thing in the world and his macro is ******* bad. His multi tasking is ******* bad.

Its so goddamn obvious that i actually feel sad for your nirvana.

edit: and getting me infracted for this post will not do you good.

Quick Comments

	ROOTPetraeus:	stop shit talking. if you don't have anything relevant to add then **** off.
	nirvAnA:	it is possible to communicate your thoughts civily, if often works better too. try it one day!
	Strafe:	You are a real man. With big muscles.

[CHoBo(kice)]

Sorry Pinder but my gf is probably a 11 and defiantly worth ******* tabbing out for.

BTW: Master Cup - I was not playing for the money.... I was playing for FUN. Getting this sort of response makes it not fun at all.

I don't see myself having a eSports career in response to Mafia and I do agree with Targa in the sense which I could be better in many aspects. But this would require investing endless amounts of time into the game which I am not prepared to do.

Quick Comments

ROCCAT_Savior:

scale is from 1-10 only, going to need pics now

[AxSGRiM]

Originally Posted by AsGCHoBo

Sorry Pinder but my gf is probably a 11 and defiantly worth ******* tabbing out for.

BTW: Master Cup - I was not playing for the money.... I was playing for FUN. Getting this sort of response makes it not fun at all.

I don't see myself having a eSports career in response to Mafia and I do agree with Targa in the sense which I could be better in many aspects. But this would require investing endless amounts of time into the game which I am not prepared to do.

pics or it didnt happen

Quick Comments

	ROCCAT_Savior:	exactly. i've been waiting for pics for over 2 hours. **** is this.
	jayaiwhy:	I can vouch