[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by kez

I think a lot of the reason golds will always be better for terran is because the mule can still mine over the scvs mining the gold base so they still mine it out quicker and get more minerals per minute than other races, also because terran is pretty reliant on minerals and gas isnt as much of an issue unless theyre going mech the more minerals they have the better, where as for zerg or protoss its not highly uncommon to see 1 or 2k minerals banked but have gas as their limiting factor, but I spose atleast they changed it somewhat

Not at all. Terran gets mules because protoss gets to chronoboost probes and zerg gets inject so they can both outproduce Terran in workers. So if mules mine the same amount regardless of where you drop them, it's actually disadvantageous for Terran to drop them on gold precisely because you are mining it out faster without the faster income the gold -should- be providing.

[Satu]

Patch change threads: The only place where you can rage about imbalance and not be called a noob

[iMSystem]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

Not at all. Terran gets mules because protoss gets to chronoboost probes and zerg gets inject so they can both outproduce Terran in workers. So if mules mine the same amount regardless of where you drop them, it's actually disadvantageous for Terran to drop them on gold precisely because you are mining it out faster without the faster income the gold -should- be providing.

While you make a good point of mining out gold bases faster, it isn't really that much of an issue.

If you accommodate to the influx of money you will get then it is still a bonus. Sure it is only temporary advantage, but I still think your dumb not to drop mules onto a gold patches for the pure fact you don't mind to mine it out fast.

Think of it this way, TvT both players are just mining minerals and producing marines / barracks, and that is it, both macroing perfectly, the only variable is that one Terran player is dropping mules on the Gold, where the other isn't.

During the Mules being dropped, the gold muling player has a temporary advantage as his income will be greater than the non-muling terran, thus giving him higher rate of production, which then leads onto more food towards units and, should we say, a slight timing attack to hit when he has a slightly greater food count.

Of course the advantage will run out and will become even again, but for a short amount of time, there is a slight advantage in the Terran that is popping mules on the Gold that I really think it isn't too much of an issue to worry about mining out a gold base quicker than normal.

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

Not at all. Terran gets mules because protoss gets to chronoboost probes and zerg gets inject so they can both outproduce Terran in workers. So if mules mine the same amount regardless of where you drop them, it's actually disadvantageous for Terran to drop them on gold precisely because you are mining it out faster without the faster income the gold -should- be providing.

yes in that way it does disadvantage terrans but gold bases are a lot harder to secure for the other races as it is (especially protoss). The issue was the fact a terran could have next to no workers land a base on the gold and drop 20 mules and get a ridiculous income for a few minutes that gives them an enormous advantage. now the bonus from a gold base shall be even which is good.

[NvPinder]

Originally Posted by SatuSPR

Patch change threads: The only place where you can rage about imbalance and not be called a noob

To be fair, most of us are absolutely thinking it with half these posts, however I'm too nervous to downvote people because I wouldn't be the first person banned for doing it ^^;;

[Peleus]

Originally Posted by SatuSPR

Patch change threads: The only place where you can rage about imbalance and not be called a noob

I love satu, he is the nicest person ever.

Quick Comments

	TAXanT:	Not nice
	ROOTPetraeus:	LOL

[ROOT`iaguz]

Reading into the ghost change a bit more I get the impression Blizzard wants us to use them to kill infestors and whilst this sounds ******* HARD rather then just sniping the shit out of everything it kinda makes sense. Snipe took 3 shots to kill an infestor, now it takes 2. This means I can have say 3-5 ghosts and when Zerg's running in the little buggers then I can focus on trying to pick 'em all off quick before they plop fungals. Once Zerg run out of fungals their late game units are terrible. Ultras cannot function without fungal they just die to tanks and marauders. Broodlords cannot function without fungal they die to everything except the tanks. The main exception to this is when you play an ultra passive TvZ lategame and the zerg builds up an enormous brood/corruptor/infestor/queen ball and nothing you have can ******* touch that.

I'm not sure what I have to do there, other then simply avoid that game state because when you get to it it means the Terran has lost.

Quick Comments

	TAEdgE:	dont know what to do on shakuras with a lead vs terran personally :D
	iMSystem:	Is the font colour in my posts white? I said this before haha.
	Nemo:	Wise

[SmirkToT]

pew pew pew pew pew pew

[nGenLight]

suck it beadface

Quick Comments

LordByrnsy:

u mean beardface right? :P

[LordByrnsy]

Originally Posted by xGKingiaguz

Reading into the ghost change a bit more I get the impression Blizzard wants us to use them to kill infestors and whilst this sounds ******* HARD rather then just sniping the shit out of everything it kinda makes sense. Snipe took 3 shots to kill an infestor, now it takes 2. This means I can have say 3-5 ghosts and when Zerg's running in the little buggers then I can focus on trying to pick 'em all off quick before they plop fungals. Once Zerg run out of fungals their late game units are terrible. Ultras cannot function without fungal they just die to tanks and marauders. Broodlords cannot function without fungal they die to everything except the tanks. The main exception to this is when you play an ultra passive TvZ lategame and the zerg builds up an enormous brood/corruptor/infestor/queen ball and nothing you have can ******* touch that.

I'm not sure what I have to do there, other then simply avoid that game state because when you get to it it means the Terran has lost.

NUUUKKEEESSSS!!! xD

[crAzerk]

@System

I don't get you. If I understand MULE change correctly, the amount harvested by a MULE is equal on gold and normal, not MULE = SCV-mining-gold.
Why then will MULEharvesting on gold lead to a higher income than MULEharvesting on normal patch?

EDIT: Sorry you were talking about the status quo aren't you >< thought you meant. Post-patch

EDIT2: No wait you ARE talking about post patch. I'm on ERASMUS's side on it, but while it WILL disadvantage Terran, but not make Terran disadvantaged. (i.e. it's a nerf on a previous imbalance)

[iMSystem]

Originally Posted by crAzerk

I don't get you. If I understand MULE change correctly, the amount harvested by a MULE is equal on gold and normal, not MULE = SCV-mining-gold.
Why then will MULEharvesting on gold lead to a higher income than MULEharvesting on normal patch?

Oh right, I assumed that a MULE mining the gold will mine at the rate of a SCV mining the gold :S

Mis-read on my part sorry

[jayaiwhy]

Will people really get Fleet Beacon to get Phoenix upgrade? .____.

When I play as P, I just push out before they have a critical mass and win...

[nirvAnA]

I like the phoenix upgrade, but if it was in the cybernetics core and took a longer time to get, rather then in the fleet bacon as that would limit the use of the range upgrade to only late game.

Quick Comments

TAXanT:

[zealous]

On the phoenix:
how will then the phoenix buff affect TvP?
phoenix will be included in the ball and medivacs will go down much faster,
how will it fair against vikings?

us terrans uses turrets when going out of base, iiric toss have cannons?

On the snipe:
On the lower league levels, rarely do we reach sniping ultra/broods,
guess we dont have enough apm for it actually,
now that we know it'll be harder, we will be more inclined to finish the game early..just saying

[ROOT`iaguz]

How will the phoenix buff affect TvP?

Not at all. Phoenixes are a unit you make when you want to lose games of TvP and if the Protoss can pay for a Fleet Beacon and for things that require a fleet beacon then they've probably already won. Phoenixes are not an answer to medivacs and vikings, stalkers and psi storms are the answer to these things.

Quick Comments

zealous:

i see! ..just remember before my opponent had stalk colo n phoenix, my medivacs were sniped down so quickly

[Benji]

Originally Posted by nirvAnA

I like the phoenix upgrade, but if it was in the cybernetics core and took a longer time to get, rather then in the fleet bacon as that would limit the use of the range upgrade to only late game.

I think that's the intention, small amounts of mutas can be handled by small groups of phoenix or blink stalker, but that massive ball they get up and wait until you move out and base trade with is countered this way.

Also gives the zerg opportunity to fake going mass muta, to force the phoenix w Beacon reaction and hit with an infestor roach hydra army or something.

All just speculation, have to see how its played out once the patch hits.

[iM MaFia]

they finally realised that ghosts r op just like when they nerfed infestors

Quick Comments

nGenLight:

hahahahahhahahahahahahahahaahah

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by kez

I think a lot of the reason golds will always be better for terran is because the mule can still mine over the scvs mining the gold base so they still mine it out quicker and get more minerals per minute than other races, also because terran is pretty reliant on minerals and gas isnt as much of an issue unless theyre going mech the more minerals they have the better, where as for zerg or protoss its not highly uncommon to see 1 or 2k minerals banked but have gas as their limiting factor, but I spose atleast they changed it somewhat

Bit of a fallacy there - it gives no more an advantage than any other mineral patch. Terrans may still choose to mule golds to deplete them faster, because it means that if their base gets killed off they'll have mined out more gold than they otherwise would have, but the overall income is no different whether they mule a gold base or their main.

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by xGKingiaguz

How will the phoenix buff affect TvP?

Not at all. Phoenixes are a unit you make when you want to lose games of TvP and if the Protoss can pay for a Fleet Beacon and for things that require a fleet beacon then they've probably already won. Phoenixes are not an answer to medivacs and vikings, stalkers and psi storms are the answer to these things.

Not to mention that as a Protoss, you can already include Phoenixes in your ball to shoot medivacs and vikings if that's what you desire.