[aLtShortizz]

IMO they deserve the starting advantage. Although as Zerg, i usually just open a normal 14g14p against random and decide what to do when i know what im playing against. Most times though, the random player seems to scout me first rather than the other way round lol. I kinda agree with JP that if you scout a random player last, u`re in for alot of trouble as protoss. But i suppose on Maps like TDA, u can send out 2 probes(2nd one after gate)?

[EveVendetta]

Shortizzz, but you scouting on 9 AND sending an extra scout will put you significantly behind compared to him scouting on 12.

Significantly only because 4 gate will always win in a PvP on Taldarim, and you'll have like 1 zealot or stalker less which means the world.

[aLtShortizz]

Originally Posted by nGenVendetta

Shortizzz, but you scouting on 9 AND sending an extra scout will put you significantly behind compared to him scouting on 12.

Significantly only because 4 gate will always win in a PvP on Taldarim, and you'll have like 1 zealot or stalker less which means the world.

Exactly, my point was the disadvantage u would have is that you have to send out 2 scouting probes. But im pretty sure most ppl would still do it. Its just one of those things that sets you back but you just gotta do it.

[sRFullstop]

I think it's fair that a Random gets that advantage. As people above said the advantage lasts only until he gets scouted, and that is within the first minute or two of the game. I think general builds are best against Random players, so for Zerg maybe a 14g/14p. Their skill level will take a long time to improve because of the 9 matchups thing, but if their skill level improves to the point where they play all matchups at their league level, they will be very hard to stop because their mechanics for each race will be good and they will have that advantage early game.

If the opponent knew a Random's race before scouting then the sole purpose of Random would be to practice all races.

[Zealo]

of course R is unfairly OP (they can make ghosts, marines, colossus AND infestors!), that's why the GSL is pretty much all R players.

[Millionaire]

As a random player myself who refuses to choose a race despite increasing competitions on ladder, I get annoyed when my opponents on ladder ask me what is my race because by being a random player,the early game advantage is what we were fighting for.
In my opinion,I think random players are weak in mirror matchups and are equally as strong when they are playing imbalanced matchups because we random players understand the strengths and weaknesses of each race as we play all races equally. Despite that, my favourite is still Protoss.

Edit : The wonderful part about playing random ...just to give some examples.
If I encounter a Protoss opponent, I will be very sure that he will never FFE.
If I encounter a Terran opponent, I will be very sure that he will never do any 2 rax cheeses before scouting me and he will always open rax into refinery.
If I encounter a Zerg opponent, I will be quite sure that he will open speedling expand.

[EscapisT]

Originally Posted by Millionaire

As a random player myself who refuses to choose a race despite increasing competitions on ladder, I get annoyed when my opponents on ladder ask me what is my race because by being a random player,the early game advantage is what we were fighting for.
In my opinion,I think random players are weak in mirror matchups and are equally as strong when they are playing imbalanced matchups because we random players understand the strengths and weaknesses of each race as we play all races equally. Despite that, my favourite is still Protoss.

Edit : The wonderful part about playing random ...just to give some examples.
If I encounter a Protoss opponent, I will be very sure that he will never FFE.
If I encounter a Terran opponent, I will be very sure that he will never do any 2 rax cheeses before scouting me and he will always open rax into refinery.
If I encounter a Zerg opponent, I will be quite sure that he will open speedling expand.

Sorry for derailing, but..
HARROW MILL I THOUGHT U GOT KIDNAPPED BY ALIENS

Back to the topic, most of the discussion has been revolving around ladder play. Another aspect will be on tournament play, using random or race picking are sometimes disallowed depending on the tournament.

I'm not familiar with major tournaments rules on this, the only random player I know in the GSL is

+ Show +

who played as Terran and Random for many months in 2011 before changing back to Protoss in the GSL October preliminaries.

+ [source] +

http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GuineaPig

I'm discerning a pattern here, Randoms end up as Protoss, which means?
Anyone familiar with top players or major tournaments regarding ?

[TADivinity]

Originally Posted by EscapisT

Anyone familiar with top players or major tournaments regarding ?

TLO did for a bit before he chose Terran didn't he?

[Zealo]

Originally Posted by EscapisT

Back to the topic, most of the discussion has been revolving around ladder play. Another aspect will be on tournament play, using random or race picking are sometimes disallowed depending on the tournament.

afaik no tournament has ever banned randoms. i don't know of (m)any major tournaments that ban race picking (PTSL did now i think about it)

i think if both players play perfectly the random has a slight advantage due to more information earlier. the fact that no randoms dominate (yet?) shows no one is close to perfect play yet

[crAzerk]

^
TLO played Random for quite bit before going to Terran if I'm not mistaken.

EDIT: Oh man divinity beat me to this post by a minute lol.

[Eddie]

I really admire players who can play random at a high level!

I think it's fair that Random gets that early game 'advantage'.

However i echo Pinders points that it's a pain as protoss, especially on Tal D
I always have to play the random as if he's Zerg until i scout otherwise...

[Highlander]

TLO went Random, to Terran, to Zerg, to Terran IIRC.

But yeah, Randoms fail at pro level. Biggest OP advantage is being 1/3 Terran.

[Zealo]

have any tournaments had a problem with morrow race picking?

[zeffrin]

Might be a bit late on this but I love randoms on the ladder... random means yeah early probe, but turtle up a bit at first and get ready to take them to macro game

[SuperHero]

The players i come across who cheese the most on ladder are usually random players.
But i dont think it gives an unfair advantage, you find out what race your opponent is within the first few minutes anyway, although this can disadvantage some playstyles where a fast expo is almost essential.

Regardless you should have a build that you use against a random player that is safe enough regardless of what race they spawn as.

[ETL.Branno]

little bit off topic but one time i verse a random player that told me he was zerg, i cautiously believed him and did my ZvZ build but scouted him anyway just in case and he turned out to be protoss. i ended up winning the game anyway with him calling zerg OP along with some other things and now ill never believe a random player again.

[Highlander]

Originally Posted by branno

little bit off topic but one time i verse a random player that told me he was zerg, i cautiously believed him and did my ZvZ build but scouted him anyway just in case and he turned out to be protoss. i ended up winning the game anyway with him calling zerg OP along with some other things and now ill never believe a random player again.

haha

I always tell the truth when asked. It doesn't matter. They never believe me anyways. :P

[Bugalugs McScruffin]

Originally Posted by Highlander

haha

I always tell the truth when asked. It doesn't matter. They never believe me anyways. :P

I tell them .

Quick Comments

Zealo:

i used to do that. now i tell them korean ;)

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by SuperHero

The players i come across who cheese the most on ladder are usually random players.
But i dont think it gives an unfair advantage, you find out what race your opponent is within the first few minutes anyway, although this can disadvantage some playstyles where a fast expo is almost essential.

Regardless you should have a build that you use against a random player that is safe enough regardless of what race they spawn as.

I just hate playing TvP agains randoms. I hate dealing with void ray all-ins when you are forced to wall off because you don't know the race. And every single random that gets protoss on ladder seems to blindly proxy a stargate somewhere on the map.

[SuperHero]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

I just hate playing TvP agains randoms. I hate dealing with void ray all-ins when you are forced to wall off because you don't know the race. And every single random that gets protoss on ladder seems to blindly proxy a stargate somewhere on the map.

Yeah that does suck but if you get a scout into their base (usually not that hard if you scout early) and see double gas, or only 1 gate and a cybercore and nothing else being built, or chronoboost being saved up for ages then you can safely assume there is something fishy going on and send out 2 scv's all over the map.

plus, the fact that they are random doesnt change the fact that a void ray all in is lame as hell and i hate them too.