[Paroxysm]

Yo, I wouldn't mind helping out and coaching some young zergies if you need it at some stage . Could coach them up to a platinum level. All i ask for in return is some practice games every now and again with some of the top tier players in the clan

Lemme know if you're interested

Paroxysm

Quick Comments

	Synizta:
	ToRsupapower:

[KAshadowz]

I'm top tier I'll practice with you

[Elusory]

my name's spelt wrongly pretty sure it isn't ahuhc haha. change it to auhc pretty please? ^^

Quick Comments

ToRSpartaz:

Oopsies bro D:

[KAshadowz]

Originally Posted by TAChadMann

Yeah I don't think having Masters and GM players in Tier 3 will work.. you might want to split and try and get a third M/Gm team or move your Plat/Dai/M/Gm players into Tier 2 and some of the plats can probably play in Tier 4...

The only possible issue that I can see with the M/GM team is that some players may show up, but if you can clear up that issue then the M/GM team should be fine. Either of chad's suggestions should work.

Another option would be that you can take some of the golds and have a T3 team of plats/golds, while moving the rest to T2

[ToRSpartaz]

Hm... Im not sure whether we should enter for the Tier 2 side, I have a lot of faith in you guys and I know that we can improve.

Whats your opinions? ^^

[ToRMaverick]

Going through all of the registrations I think we may have a tough time with a Tier 2 team, as there are some pretty awesome line-ups in there. They are predominantly players with some and in the mix.

The issue for us is that we don’t quite have the numbers up top but in saying that, the way the tournament is structured you can always give it a go then if our Tier 2 team is struggling we would be challenged by the top Tier 3 team for our spot at the end of the season.... the comp will ballance things out over time.

Originally Posted by Frogmite

Last two teams of Tier 2 will play Up/Down matches GSL style with the top two teams of Tier 3. The top 2 winners will play in Tier 2 for next season, the losers will be playing for Tier 3.

I also believe we need to promote our GMs / Master players and give them a chance to play against other suitable opponents. Having GMs in a Tier 3 team isn’t really giving them a chance to play were the need to be…

My suggestion at this stage would be as per Kashadowz response…

Originally Posted by KAshadowz

Another option would be that you can take some of the golds and have a T3 team of plats/golds, while moving the rest to T2

I understand there is a ballance issue in relation to having enough people showing up to play and also not having too many that only a select few get to play. If we are at all serious about and actually give a dam about each other then we really need to show some commitment until we can gather a few more numbers to help with any possible no shows....

Thats my thoughts anyways... GL with the decision as it will never please everyone.

[breadfan]

I think it should be left up to the players in that team.

From my perspective, it seems like it's the issue of letting everyone get involved (including the GMs) vs cutting people out for greater success

For everyone to be involved, it means we're going to have a mostly tier 3-suited team playing in tier 2, which means they can probably expect a lot of losses. This may affect morale (maybe people won't show up week after week if it's to get their ass handed to them) but some people might take the view that this is an excellent chance to take on some masters players, get some valuable experience and help their personal progression.

Of course, if we can't provide a way for GMs to participate (who are the most serious players among us) then they may seek other places, meaning that we'll struggle to build up for the next season.

Basically, it depends where the individuals themselves stand on that issue. Personally, I'd be in the Tier 2 camp, and I kind of hope it swings that way

[ToRSpartaz]

Originally Posted by Paroxysm

Yo, I wouldn't mind helping out and coaching some young zergies if you need it at some stage . Could coach them up to a platinum level. All i ask for in return is some practice games every now and again with some of the top tier players in the clan

Lemme know if you're interested

Paroxysm

Always love the help bro hang around with us mate and practice with the top tier players bro ^^ they always willing to reaally boss it out xD

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by TAChadMann

Yeah I don't think having Masters and GM players in Tier 3 will work.. you might want to split and try and get a third M/Gm team or move your Plat/Dai/M/Gm players into Tier 2 and some of the plats can probably play in Tier 4...

Other teams in T3 are already chock full of masters. On average our team is still weak for that division. Not being all kill format makes the whole one strong player argument incredibly weak. Even if Dano and Jae carry with 2 kills every week, we only barely win, and if everyone knows they will play Dano for ace every week they can plan their best vT to go ace. Im sure there are plenty of masters in tier 3 who can take him down if they know that.

It also seems silly if we have to force clans to just rush and try to pick up a bunch of players that aren't a good fit just to fill out a roster with people in specific leagues.

Quick Comments

oo0zula0oo:

ur back! u can see the forums~ and i agree no point to get players we dont or connect with~

[syfChadMann]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

Other teams in T3 are already chock full of masters. On average our team is still weak for that division. Not being all kill format makes the whole one strong player argument incredibly weak. Even if Dano and Jae carry with 2 kills every week, we only barely win, and if everyone knows they will play Dano for ace every week they can plan their best vT to go ace. Im sure there are plenty of masters in tier 3 who can take him down if they know that.

It also seems silly if we have to force clans to just rush and try to pick up a bunch of players that aren't a good fit just to fill out a roster with people in specific leagues.

While I haven't been thru all the rosters yet to check how many Masters and GMs there are in each team, I still feel that this many Masters and Gms is a bit OP... if the two Gms play and win every week then the worst you'll do is get a draw... (unless on the off chance, they lose). Also, if this team wins with out separation into two teams, next season you'll see this team in Tier 2 - the plats included..

While there has been no ruling on this yet, I'd suggest splitting into two teams is advisable, I'll talk to Lemminks and Frogmite about it soon and see if it permitted.


EDIT: Just had a browse through some of the teams rosters that have signed up. None have Gms and I think there is only 1 with a Master league player - VB, who also have a few golds in the Tier 3 team.

[breadfan]

Originally Posted by TAChadMann

Also, if this team wins with out separation into two teams, next season you'll see this team in Tier 2 - the plats included..

This is a very very good point - I mentioned that it might be tough on the players to keep coming back if they get put into Tier 2 and keep losing, but they are going to face that next season anyway.

[|Erasmus|]

This whole conversation seems mighty confusing having (I think) missed most of it...

Why we seem to have numerous naming conventions for this stuff is something I don't know. But , I assume it's like this:

Sharn Kemp SEA Premier League - Only and by invite (Tier 1)
(We might have to split tier 2 into A/B)
SC2SEA Championship League A: - Mostly (Tier 2)

SC2SEA Championship League B: - Mostly (Tier 3)

SC2SEA League 1: Mostly (Tier 4)

SC2SEA League 2: Mostly (Tier 5)

I have no idea how this argument can go that we are way too strong for Tier 3. Ask anyone qualified the difference between random highish masters player and GM outside top 100, and most answers will be that it's largely irrelevant. And the average strength of the team is just silly for tier 2.

@superman: It's not giving me errors from here at work, but I should stop wasting time...

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by TAChadMann

While I haven't been thru all the rosters yet to check how many Masters and GMs there are in each team, I still feel that this many Masters and Gms is a bit OP... if the two Gms play and win every week then the worst you'll do is get a draw... (unless on the off chance, they lose). Also, if this team wins with out separation into two teams, next season you'll see this team in Tier 2 - the plats included..

While there has been no ruling on this yet, I'd suggest splitting into two teams is advisable, I'll talk to Lemminks and Frogmite about it soon and see if it permitted.

to put it in perspective for you the crux B team which is entirely - 3 people masters players is in tier 3. tier 2 is you can have an entire team of gm players is the difference. You also have to remember you are putting a lot of pressure on Jae and Danosuar to win every time to even get a draw which is hard and Eramus has an exellent point of view on this if they know that one of those two is ace every match then it gives the oppoent an advantage in knowing itl be a T or P. Also remember GM doesnt really mean that much over the high masters players its more who ahs the better mmr at the time for example cruxDoc aka Souljah missed out on gm but is top of masters still matching up vs top 50 gms. Theres no way that teams op mate and if you look at tier two teams im sure you will see why ^_^ glgl ToR Hwaiting

[syfChadMann]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

This whole conversation seems mighty confusing having (I think) missed most of it...

Why we seem to have numerous naming conventions for this stuff is something I don't know. But , I assume it's like this:

Sharn Kemp SEA Premier League - Only and by invite (Tier 1)
(We might have to split tier 2 into A/B)
SC2SEA Championship League A: - Mostly (Tier 2)

SC2SEA Championship League B: - Mostly (Tier 3)

SC2SEA League 1: Mostly (Tier 4)

SC2SEA League 2: Mostly (Tier 5)

I have no idea how this argument can go that we are way too strong for Tier 3. Ask anyone qualified the difference between random highish masters player and GM outside top 100, and most answers will be that it's largely irrelevant. And the average strength of the team is just silly for tier 2.

@superman: It's not giving me errors from here at work, but I should stop wasting time...

I think the confusion here is that Tier 5 doesn't exist, and (what you have listed as Tier 2 and tier 3 is Tier 2 (A and B)...

So your team is aimed at the Tier 2 B league? thats fine... I was assuming when you said Tier 3, which is the PDCL...

so it should be more like:
Sharn Kemp SEA Premier League - Only and by invite (Tier 1)
(We might have to split tier 2 into A/B)
SC2SEA Championship League A: - Mostly (Tier 2)

SC2SEA Championship League B: - Mostly (Tier 2B)

SC2SEA League 1: Mostly (Tier 3)

SC2SEA League 2: Mostly (Tier 4)

And your team is aimed at the Tier 2B league?..

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by cruxStallion

to put it in perspective for you the crux B team which is entirely - 3 people masters players is in tier 3. tier 2 is you can have an entire team of gm players is the difference. You also have to remember you are putting a lot of pressure on Jae and Danosuar to win every time to even get a draw which is hard and Eramus has an exellent point of view on this if they know that one of those two is ace every match then it gives the oppoent an advantage in knowing itl be a T or P. Also remember GM doesnt really mean that much over the high masters players its more who ahs the better mmr at the time for example cruxDoc aka Souljah missed out on gm but is top of masters still matching up vs top 50 gms. Theres no way that teams op mate and if you look at tier two teams im sure you will see why ^_^ glgl ToR Hwaiting

How are maps determined for this league too, cause that has an effect. Knowing you are against Dano with first map shak for example, you don't send out a zerg.

Also nice to know what day or time this runs at for people to make a commitment. Like, we have to be 100% committed to sign up, but I know there are days/times I just can't do. But I don't know this comp doesn't run then yet.

Do we publish our 5 players ahead of time, or pick as we go? In the second case they are 100% sure of our ace if we have used one of our two GMs already and can send a sniper. So many factors involved, and we don't really know anything about them yet.

Also, the whole 2A/2B thing doesn't make any sense. Just call them tier 1-5. I don't think there's anything special about tier 2 which works differently to the others, right?

[ToRDeathsFang]

We cant have a Tier 1 team, we're not good enough/ don't have enough players. I think that we should keep it at having our Tier 4 BSG team, Tier 3 PD team and put all our Masters/ GM's into a Tier 2. That's the simplest way to do it and we will have 3 full teams.

No need to over-complicate things

Quick Comments

	syfChadMann:	yep
	KAshadowz:	definitely simplest :)

[syfChadMann]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

How are maps determined for this league too, cause that has an effect. Knowing you are against Dano with first map shak for example, you don't send out a zerg.

Also nice to know what day or time this runs at for people to make a commitment. Like, we have to be 100% committed to sign up, but I know there are days/times I just can't do. But I don't know this comp doesn't run then yet.

Do we publish our 5 players ahead of time, or pick as we go? In the second case they are 100% sure of our ace if we have used one of our two GMs already and can send a sniper. So many factors involved, and we don't really know anything about them yet.

Also, the whole 2A/2B thing doesn't make any sense. Just call them tier 1-5. I don't think there's anything special about tier 2 which works differently to the others, right?

Information will be out soon... I'm not sure how other leagues will run but we will try and be flexible and teams are permitted to arrange a time that isn't the standard time to play their matches.

The lines ups should be pm'd to the admin of that league before the match. Also, as its not King of the hill format games can be played concurrently or if needed I'm sure upon request 1 or 2 games could be played at a later time/date

The 2a/2b thing came up because alot of teams were submitting teams for tier 2... and there was a notable gap in skill in some of these teams, so they were split into a A and B division.

Regardless, the line up that is being discussed here, should be fine for Tier 2b.. Tier 3 is where there may be issues.

Thanks, hopefully this is all cleared up now - keep your eyes out for more updates soon!

[Frogmite]

Yeah basically i made a system of points that ranks the teams in the good division. So in general it's better for the team to be balanced (either GM/masters or masters/diamond,...), there will be greater chances they'll play in the division that suit them the best.

If you want to keep it simple:

Tier 1 : only
Tier 2 : /
Tier 3: /
Tier 4:

Hope it helps.

[|Erasmus|]

Originally Posted by DeathsFang

We cant have a Tier 1 team, we're not good enough/ don't have enough players. I think that we should keep it at having our Tier 4 BSG team, Tier 3 PD team and put all our Masters/ GM's into a Tier 2. That's the simplest way to do it and we will have 3 full teams.

No need to over-complicate things

Except we don't have enough players for that... :/

[syfChadMann]

Originally Posted by Frogmite

Yeah basically i made a system of points that ranks the teams in the good division. So in general it's better for the team to be balanced (either GM/masters or masters/diamond,...), there will be greater chances they'll play in the division that suit them the best.

If you want to keep it simple:

Tier 1 : only
Tier 2 : /
Tier 3: /
Tier 4:

Hope it helps.

Really?
My understanding was that it was:
Tier 1 : only
Tier 2A : /
Tier 2B : (mainly)
Tier 3: /
Tier 4: