[PiG]

Originally Posted by mGMUSE

(replays in next post)

After 3 seasons..

Game2(TDA)

Once again, completely no drone scout, doesn't even see my base until my nat starts mining(and even then only the edge of the glowing minerals).

1:55 - 2:10: Watch my SCV scout and his line of sight - He NEVER sees the SCV on any of his overlord yet he decides to change the path of his Drone(that was going to be a hatch) downwards to avoid my SCV. Clear tell imo.

3:15 - 3:30: Again, look at his line of sight - He doesn't see the bunker building yet he pulls 3 drones immediately. Sure, you could say that his overlord spotted my scv for a brief moment at 3:15, but LOOK AT HIS PLAYER CAM - HE WASN'T LOOKING AT THAT SPOT!

5:45: Roach Warren when he hasn't scouted me AT ALL and I seemed to be bunker pushing him(roaches are usually more reserved for reaper openings). Probably production tab hacking - He saw that I was making reactored hellions

6:00: Preemptive split of zerglings right before my hellions came in. An excellent player might be able to do that

Rest of the game didnt have much of a tell, but just keep an eye on the Production tab as well as my activities and his.

14:10: Banes morph RIGHT BEFORE my army reaches his base without seeing my army move out.

Final battle - Not very suspicious but he attacks right before my reinforcements arrives.

*The drone dodging the scv is unexplainable but is not proof in of itself. Sometimes you see chronoboost and other animations through fog of war and as your scv goes past his overlord barely out of vision I think he may have been able to see it in-game even if we can't in the replay this is just a small possibility. Also he could have had his hatchery blocked in previous games and was just taking precautions to avoid the possibility of scouting scvs. Whilst this sounds stupid I see players do this sort of thing ALL the time where they blindcounter things because they've been fighting it on ladder alot.

*He doesn't have an overlord over the hatchery and sees the scv go near it, pulling 3 drones to deal with it is understandable.

*This was ages ago soon after i coached evets how to play vs reactor helions with early roaches. If I'm not misinterpreting it looks like he's playing rather blind simply because he's focusing on his new build order. Now to react with a warren against a 1 rax bunker pressure by expecting helions following it is absolutely standard... you only could have gone helions or 1 rax FE from here. So evets actually made a mistake by going roaches without scouting/verifying you had taken gas and weren't expanding. Basically he was just assuming he had to defend the more aggressive of the 2 options (obviously reactor helions are more aggressive then 1 rax fe...) and prepared accordingly.

*pre-split zerglings is normal. if you don't have anything but lings to defend helions then its standard
*He just got raped by an attack and morphs alot of banes defensively against a player who's shown Marine marauder + blueflame play. This is in no way a tell.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:
	TAScarecrow:

[Nemo]

Originally Posted by Arnor@CityHunter

I really dont think VODs of you streaming yourself proves anything as IF a person was map hacking theyd be rather foolish to leave the hacks enabled while they were streaming, Im not accusing you in any way, just saying you might want to come up with better evidence

It's all good piece of evidence. For example if a suspect move from a replay is shown on a Vod of the stream it can clear it.
I will look at it closely tomorrow (for me), promise, first thing I do when I get up. Remember someone is innocent until proven guilty (or very suspect).

[ToR.Arnor]

Originally Posted by Nemo

It's all good piece of evidence. For example if a suspect move from a replay is shown on a Vod of the stream it can clear it.
I will look at it closely tomorrow (for me), promise, first thing I do when I get up. Remember someone is innocent until proven guilty (or very suspect).

innocent until proven guilty is not the case in many countries (particularly in criminal law) where the onus of proof falls to the accused not the accuser, a little off topic but still something interesting to note! :P

[PiG]

Originally Posted by pRoTimber

think of "minimap" hack/ sensor tower hack then u will see

I see some suspect things going on. I also see both of you playing pretty badly.

If you would chill and point out the points in the rep you think are suspect I would love to reply to them and try to convince you otherwise. Timber I've played you alot on ladder and you are the cheesiest terran I know. I don't mean that as an insult but I mean that you all-in constantly. Play very low-econ and love drops and elevators. As such you are very predictable and someone preparing for that sort of play is not out off the question.

His low muta count being placed in the main makes perfect sense, as his army at the nat is covering his 3rd. What doesn't make sense is half his army running through watchtower vision soon after you leave the tower. But you know what, if you watch all your saved replays trying to look for maphackers you can always find some "evidence" that it exists. Looking at this replay he could have done so many things so much better especially if he was maphacking that I really don't see why it would enrage you that his movements in one situation are suspect.

I've never had trouble beating evets and he's such a nice guy that I find 2 replays posted by a player who won (muse) and a player who should have won (timber) to be unconvincing. I've seen evets play amazing games mechanically and decision-making wise. And the evidence you provided shows some pretty sub-par play with 1-2 strangely intuitive decisions. I really feel he would have dominated 10 times as hard if he was actually hacking.

This is just my opinion and i am extremely biased as evets is a friend and ex-student. But I do feel that the evidence you provided of you ragequitting after playing badly, and then providing mostly bad points (muse) and zero points other then something about map awareness (timber) I think you are both reacting with your hearts and not your heads.

[Nemo]

Originally Posted by PiG

This is just my opinion and i am extremely biased as evets is a friend and ex-student. But I do feel that the evidence you provided of you ragequitting after playing badly, and then providing mostly bad points (muse) and zero points other then something about map awareness (timber) I think you are both reacting with your hearts and not your heads.

PiG, you're super very stronger than so many of us and can see so many things we can't (I think it, really). But please, please, don't jump on conclusions before giving time to time, especially since you admit you're extremely biased. Since it's your student and friend, that's not your call to judge it. Let neutral people have their analysis about it. If you don't it will get everyone nervous very quick.

Quick Comments

	PiG:	good point, sorry
	x5.Revenant:

[[TA]LoSt]

I reckon the worst possible thing you could of done was start streaming after the accusations to try and "prove" you don't. If you had VODs of the games you played that they're uploading then it would be perfect, but streaming now is pointless.

. It became addicting to use the hack it made things so much easier even though my level was high without it.

^ Quote from a reformed maphacker and respected member of the community. Saying "if you're capable of performing at or around that level why would you maphack" is stupid.

Good thing is that you're a respected community member, and whether you maphacked or not it won't be proven without replays from a long time ago as I'm sure any maphackers who get accused here will almost definitely stop using the hacks from now on.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with what anyone is saying, there's nothing that needs to be added that hasn't already been said - I'm just saying I think you handled this the wrong way to clear your name.

Quick Comments

	EXCL:	yeah i agree :)
	cRSenSei:	this quote seems rather familiar
	deL:	I wouldn't trust a quote from a disgusting hacker like the guy who said that.
	Volition:	great post, insightful and adding to the discussion

[aLtShortizz]

Originally Posted by [TA]LoSt

I reckon the worst possible thing you could of done was start streaming after the accusations to try and "prove" you don't. If you had VODs of the games you played that they're uploading then it would be perfect, but streaming now is pointless.


^ Quote from a reformed maphacker and respected member of the community. Saying "if you're capable of performing at or around that level why would you maphack" is stupid.

Good thing is that you're a respected community member, and whether you maphacked or not it won't be proven without replays from a long time ago as I'm sure any maphackers who get accused here will almost definitely stop using the hacks from now on.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with what anyone is saying, there's nothing that needs to be added that hasn't already been said - I'm just saying I think you handled this the wrong way to clear your name.

I thought he handled it well, he just kept playing and didnt kick up a big fuss about the accusation. By proving and streaming his game, hes just going about his normal regime and reminding ppl that he streams and doesnt need to hack to play.

On the other hand, accusing ppl of hacking after 1-2 game without a replay that suggests a blatant hack was used isnt the best way to handle it. I mean even if it was proven that Evets is not a hacker, ur essentially leaving a mark on his name. Ppl will obviously link their thoughts to a ?Hacker the next time they mention his name or play against him.

[FaDeEvetS]

I've had alot of irl shit going on lately, i won't go into all the details as this isn't an excuse it's just an explanation.
I woke up feeling pretty depressed as I have been lately (honestly, i'm not trying to excuse what i did or ask for pity or anything, i'm just explaining WHY i felt like i needed to do it), and really just felt like....shitting on someone and seeing how stupid the hacks were.
(This was the first ladder game against protimber)
This is why i was so unstable in the game, letting hellions in etc as hacking is actually pretty distracting (i imagine you get used to it) and this is why i looked so incredibly suss, as i'm not used to hiding hacks (or hacking), although i did one other time back in the diamond league.
I know this was really stupid to do, especially as i was a somewhat trusted member of the community and i honestly don't know if that can be restored.
I would however like to emphasise that it was just this one ladder game and i have not cheated in any competitions either formal or otherwise.
I really wasn't sure if i'd be able to own up to this, and i'm sorry to the entire community (especially timber).
I know no matter what i say/do/show it'll be extremely difficult to ever see anything i do or have done as not being hacked. With this in mind, If fade wishes me to leave i'll understand, as i dont want this stigma to be associated with any other members.

I'm sorry, i know hacking is a low-life shit thing to do and i hope that eventually i can earn some form of trust back.


EDIT: I'm also extremely sorry to the people who were defending me, as i know I've ruined alot of the trust and friendship they provided me

Quick Comments

	deL:	FaDeSenSei
	Volition:	At least you were a man and owned up to it- late, but you did it.
	FaDeBadger:
	FaDeGofire:	what a joke
	TAScarecrow:	fake sincerity: a useful skill toi have
	TAriiChard:	.....
	iM yang:	Multiple replays posted, you say only once..
	faithHunter:	Takes balls to admit that you were hacking, considering all the things you have to put in line.

[TAEdarus]

Kinda gobsmacked to have to read that to be honest...

You may have lost some trust from people within the community but you haven't lost my respect for being honest about it.

Quick Comments

	FaDeEvetS:	thank you
	nirvAnA:	Agreed. Lost respect for EvetS but coming out to admit it like that takes balls.

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by FaDeEvetS

I've had alot of irl shit going on lately, i won't go into all the details as this isn't an excuse it's just an explanation.
I woke up feeling pretty depressed as I have been lately (honestly, i'm not trying to excuse what i did or ask for pity or anything, i'm just explaining WHY i felt like i needed to do it), and really just felt like....shitting on someone and seeing how stupid the hacks were.
(This was the first ladder game against protimber)
This is why i was so unstable in the game, letting hellions in etc as hacking is actually pretty distractingyou (i imagine get used to it) and this is why i looked so incredibly suss, as i'm not used to hiding hacks (or hacking), although i did one other time back in the diamond league.
I know this was really stupid to do, especially as i was a somewhat trusted member of the community and i honestly don't know if that can be restored.
I would however like to emphasise that it was just this one ladder game and i have not cheated in any competitions either formal or otherwise.
I really wasn't sure if i'd be able to own up to this, and i'm sorry to the entire community (especially timber).
I know no matter what i say/do/show it'll be extremely difficult to ever see anything i do or have done as not being hacked. With this in mind, If fade wishes me to leave i'll understand, as i dont want this stigma to be associated with any other members.

I'm sorry, i know hacking is a low-life shit thing to do and i hope that eventually i can earn some form of trust back.


EDIT: I'm also extremely sorry to the people who were defending me, as i know I've ruined alot of the trust and friendship they provided me

Correct me if I'm wrong, but basically you're trying to say that you've only hacked in ONE ladder game(Against Timber) right? Just asking out of curiosity, since I've only met you on ladder once.

P.S. Having shit IRL does not justify/entitle you to do screw with others by doing a "low-life shit thing". Everyone goes through tons of shit IRL on a regular basis.

P.P.S You're killing E-sports

[FaDeEvetS]

yes that's what i meant, and i know it doesnt make it alright. i wasn't providing an excuse just an explanation

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by FaDeEvetS

yes that's what i meant, and i know it doesnt make it alright. i wasn't providing an excuse just an explanation

Then what about the games with the other players that have stated that you were hacking in this thread? They did also bring out proof...

[FaDeEvetS]

Originally Posted by Revenant

Then what about the games with the other players that have stated that you were hacking in this thread? They did also bring out proof...

those ones were inaccurate.
I know you have shitall reason to trust what i say, but that's..it

Edit; i have to go out, i'll comment/read the thread later

[aLtShortizz]

Originally Posted by FaDeEvetS

I've had alot of irl shit going on lately, i won't go into all the details as this isn't an excuse it's just an explanation.
I woke up feeling pretty depressed as I have been lately (honestly, i'm not trying to excuse what i did or ask for pity or anything, i'm just explaining WHY i felt like i needed to do it), and really just felt like....shitting on someone and seeing how stupid the hacks were.
(This was the first ladder game against protimber)
This is why i was so unstable in the game, letting hellions in etc as hacking is actually pretty distracting (i imagine you get used to it) and this is why i looked so incredibly suss, as i'm not used to hiding hacks (or hacking), although i did one other time back in the diamond league.
I know this was really stupid to do, especially as i was a somewhat trusted member of the community and i honestly don't know if that can be restored.
I would however like to emphasise that it was just this one ladder game and i have not cheated in any competitions either formal or otherwise.
I really wasn't sure if i'd be able to own up to this, and i'm sorry to the entire community (especially timber).
I know no matter what i say/do/show it'll be extremely difficult to ever see anything i do or have done as not being hacked. With this in mind, If fade wishes me to leave i'll understand, as i dont want this stigma to be associated with any other members.

I'm sorry, i know hacking is a low-life shit thing to do and i hope that eventually i can earn some form of trust back.


EDIT: I'm also extremely sorry to the people who were defending me, as i know I've ruined alot of the trust and friendship they provided me

Im very shocked to read this, but also glad that u admitted to this. Anyone who has defended you(myself and i assume pig) would. Im in shock right now as i really believed u played very well when i watched ur stream.

Glad that u admitted to you, still a friend here if u ever need anything!

[TAEdarus]

Honestly the only time I've ever cheated in games were single player ones where I just want to watch stuff die (shooters and the like)... Like Jedi Knight, spawn a bajillion Storm Troopers, godmode on, limb dismemberment on, slice slice!!

If you're in a bad way mentally / emotionally and just wanted a win / to feel a hulk smashing, do it against an AI because they don't hold grudges or judge you... its pretty unfair to tarnish someone else's record stats reputation whatever by using cheats to literally cheat them out of a deserved win.

Quick Comments

x5.Revenant:

Well said on the moral PoV

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by FaDeEvetS

those ones were inaccurate.
I know you have shitall reason to trust what i say, but that's..it

Edit; i have to go out, i'll comment/read the thread later

Gahhh, sorry if I missed my point on the previous post. What I mean is, it doesn't seem logical for a person to hack only in one game, and not want to repeatedly do it.

Secondly, what makes what your claims more unbelievable is because you did not own up to hacking(at all) when you started posting, and even tried to convince people otherwise. Brings down the trust that people had in you even more, and would have been good if you just confessed at the very first post that you made.

Sorry if I've been too harsh, and it's great that you came clean with it in the end.

Quick Comments

	[TA]LoSt:	Thats what I was saying in my post too, he incriminated himself further..
	TAriiChard:

[aLtShortizz]

Originally Posted by Revenant

Gahhh, sorry if I missed my point on the previous post. What I mean is, it doesn't seem logical for a person to hack only in one game, and not want to repeatedly do it.

Secondly, what makes what your claims more unbelievable is because you did not own up to hacking(at all) when you started posting, and even tried to convince people otherwise. Brings down the trust that people had in you even more, and would have been good if you just confessed at the very first post that you made.

Sorry if I've been too harsh, and it's great that you came clean with it in the end.

He meant that today was his first time trying the hack.

[lolwut]

I can understand your angry actions Evet's but hacking was the wrong thing to do. My opinion is neutral about you though because you had the balls to own up to it

[x5.Revenant]

Originally Posted by aLtShortizz

He meant that today was his first time trying the hack.

Think of it this way. He hacked on the first game against timber. And then he switched off his hack and proceeded to continue laddering. Doesn't it sound fishy on why the person would turn off his hack when he had no reason to?

[crAzerk]

@ Rev /Shortizz
Whatever it is, he has been named and shamed, and he has 'fessed up. Nothing else more to say really, I guess you can rub salt into the wounds by further expressing your disgust , etc, but, what for?

Quick Comments

	aLtShortizz:	Good point, ill leave it as it is. Not rubbing anything though =P
	x5.Revenant:	It's good that he had the guts to 'fess up, but it's debatable whether he comes clean with everything ^^