[Stallion]

The Stally build

Ok so after a few requests about my PvZ build I won a game vs dKiller with I'm going to do a write up on it and try to insert some images in so I hope they work. Also I realise I'm not the best player in the world but this is a build that people may want to try if your having trouble with PvZ. The main thing is you need to have decent apm as your going to be force-fielding and positioning as well as picking up with phoenix at one point in most scenarios.

Overall Idea

The idea of this build is to get to 3 base and be safe on it with harassment potential and get ahead on upgrades on any map. This is hardest on Shakura's and Ohana.

Opening

The opening is the simple part. Forge fast expand is an excellent way to open and this is my go to opening. I will explain this build like you have done my standard opening which is rally the 8th probe out to make the first pylon then pull him back to mining. rally the 12th probe out to make the forge then scout with him immediately after.

Pylon block and reacting to timings

If on a 2 base map you should use all your chrono and get to 17 probes as you are moving across the map with the probe. From here drop a pylon to delay the zergs expand or to force him to instantly take the 3rd. The advantage of this is slowing them down as well as knowing where they take there 3rd as well as you can drop the nexus before the cannon its a tiny thing but helps with faster chrono and probe production. Disadvantage is if you forget the replacement pylon in the wall you will get supply blocked for a bit. Also a key point here is [/b]keep your scouting probe alive[/b]. this is so you can re scout the 3rd to make sure its there the timing is 4:30 or should be on the 3rd if he isn't taking a 3rd he is roach ling all inning you or ling bling all inning drop cannons (4 is how many i do).

Early Pools
The trick to dealing with an early pool is to cancel the pylon block and get a cannon and wall up asap for anything but a 6 pool pull probes if you want. With the original probe scout when you go into the base it should be 3/4 done.

Hatch first

What if he hatch firsts with the Stally build? My answer cannons and lots of them. Bring a 2nd probe and get them cannons down. 4 should do the trick.

Now assuming the cannons worked prepare for a counter attack hold it off and expand. Remember to get the expand down asap while being safe you do NOT want lings in your base

2 base aggression and scouting

Stargate is the name of the game for this build. 1 void ray 5 phoenixes to be precise is the general rule of thumb. The reason I open this way is stargate play for PvZ is similar to what hellions used/do do for TvZ. they limit the zerg vision (generally there's 2 overlords around to snipe). You want to try and do your economic damage and hide these if you can. A queen or drones is free damage I generally expect to do no damage and get a pleasant surprise if I do. after the first void ray attacks pull him back to your main army and get your phoenix to overlord kill and scout. Keep the void ray alive. You want to find out if he has gone for mass roach/infestors/hydras.

2 base macro

So behind this aggression you want to fully saturate both bases. This means all 4 gas taken and having 3 workers and 20 workers on both mineral lines (2 and a half lines = max saturation). Your tech should be a robotics asap behind the Stargate without letting him scout it. Their are generally 2 overlords to clean up with Stargate its your choice on wither to clean them up and hide the robotics behind or try to do damage with the Stargate and risk the Zerg getting the knowledge. Your first 2 units out of your robotics need to be immortals. add gates up to 6. So you should be on stargate robo 6 gate. also you should be 1-1 as you expand.

Expanding to a third

Ok so lets assume you have a normal game, they deny any real damage and you are looking at taking your 3rd heres some key things you need to do with this build. you should have enough gas to get a max of 6 sentrys out also most likely you will lose them later so remember to rebuild them. So taking the 3rd get the pylon down early for you want 2 cannons asap.

If another important aspect is if there's another attack path wall it off asap after this. This will stop ling run bys as well as getting your army in the right place. during this phase you want to focus on not getting supply blocked and reacting right. As you get the 3rd up and running you want to start probe production again as well as dropping a twilight council, a second forge and two more gates. note that if they go hydras you should drop more cannons to hold and get robotics bay asap to get colossus out asap but you should hold without them if you don't supply block and fight with cannons. This is why this build is hardest on Shakura's too.

After the aggression

You should have 5 phoenixes and be getting 2-2 and blink as well as getting out a few colossus and getting 2 more gates giving you a very solid base leading into the mid-late game. get your phoenix to scout the 4th and pick off as many transferring drones as you can. add 2 more gates. From here its up to you on how you want to go about things.

What if he goes muta!?

This build shouldn't die to Muta. In fact if the zerg goes muta I generally smile. Just leave some muta make more phoenix and get the phoenix range increase. leave cannons (6 is enough to deal with counter attacks I find) so you can push out if you choose or take a 4th after it's up to you and the game. A fast mothership is generally the way I go while I take the 4th and get a few colossus to own the lings. Muta is very subjective to how much damage they do. If they do none I'd count myself ahead ( this is just my opinion)

Replays

vs dkiller- http://www.sc2sea.com/replays.php?do=viewreplay&id=1142
vs cREdge - http://www.sc2sea.com/replays.php?do=viewreplay&id=769
vs ttPiG - http://www.sc2sea.com/replays.php?do=viewreplay&id=1102


I hope this helps anyone who wants a new way of playing PvZ gl hf
Any questions just ask and I shall update the thread ^_^
also spell check fail *sigh* excuse the spelling mistakes

Quick Comments

	xGKingdelete:
	nirvAnA:	Awesome! Link to the replay where you demolished d.Killer!
	SLCN.NXZ:	STALLY BUILD
	Eddie:
	Makuly:
	cruxSpoon:	The build that will mount the world!

[xGKingdelete]

sweet, going to start adopting this style of PvZ very soon

p.s. first

[asdfSchnitzel]

Really awesome write up! Might use this in the future!

p.s. second

[SLCN.NXZ]

My only gripe with this is that you make a few extra colossus vs muta, you can do it but its honestly just saying "I think your mutas arent gonna be an issue so Im gonna keep making some colossus anyway". I think u should switch to HT and dont spread you're gas too thin (making tons of everything) for example in the tgun vs socke from egmcsl tgun is ridiculously behind and socke starts to add colossus back into his army and tgun just overwhelms him with mass muta.

Other than that the NXZ build beats this but I'm pretty sure thats because stallion is the greediest toss player on the planet.

Otherwise sick build, even sicker player, and STARGATE IMBA

[x5.NotoriouS]

Nice detailed write up man, u should be doing this for TGM haha.. hint to NirvanA

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by aLtNXZ

My only gripe with this is that you make a few extra colossus vs muta, you can do it but its honestly just saying "I think your mutas arent gonna be an issue so Im gonna keep making some colossus anyway". I think u should switch to HT and dont spread you're gas too thin (making tons of everything) for example in the tgun vs socke from egmcsl tgun is ridiculously behind and socke starts to add colossus back into his army and tgun just overwhelms him with mass muta.

Other than that the NXZ build beats this but I'm pretty sure thats because stallion is the greediest toss player on the planet.

Otherwise sick build, even sicker player, and STARGATE IMBA

yea i've been vsing more people who are using drops and the way I deal with them is using the phenox to target overlords and get that obs to see it coming so I limit damage with spread i think the main reaslon i was losing to it before is getting myself trapped on shak hurts. Also i don't mean you keep making colossus straight away its more as you can as they generally have a lot of lings with muta play

[jayaiwhy]

I hate my infestors being picked up by your phoenix

Quick Comments

Stallion:

i enjoy it tho :P

[QEDjuslai]

dffntly gonna try this having a hard time with zerg

[ProAnnn]

Awesome guide.

A guide that most protoss who favours stargate play should absolutely follow.

Too bad i pretty much HATE stargate play so wont be utilizing this build

Great write up though!

Quick Comments

Stallion:

ty sir

[PiG]

This is a really nice way to play this style. Little things like intercepting the drones to 4th drives me nuts as a zerg and shows how retaining your air is very useful.

Also a focus on identifying opponents tech early and responding makes it seem exceptionally smart approach. A note to anyone trying this style: this is defensive macro play and you need to put in a lot of time to perfect this sort of play. Up until that point you will die to a lot of silly stuff! But once you have it down it'll really pay off and give you a structure upon which to really improve.

Excuse my spelling n grammar I'm on a train!

Quick Comments

Stallion:

HES ON A TRAIN AND ITS GOING FAST haha thanks ^_^

[nGenLight]

This build is shit, ur not even top 150 on SEA.

[x5.NotoriouS]

Originally Posted by xGKingLight

This build is shit, ur not even top 150 on SEA.

I thought TargA got banned

[nGenLight]

^ You sir, are not even top 600 in SEA, you do not possess the priviledge to talk, you peasant.

Ok sorry thread derailment over. Stargate openers are by far the most APM taxing/difficult Protoss play, and due to this reason, also the opener with the highest potential. Great share.

Quick Comments

Stallion:

ty :)

[x5.NotoriouS]

Originally Posted by xGKingLight

^ You sir, are not even top 600 in SEA, you do not possess the priviledge to talk, you peasant.

my rank says 70 tho T_T

Quick Comments

	ROOTPetraeus:	did you not hear what light said?
	mGGAequitas:	on lights ranking system not blizzard's

[SLCNPezz]

Hasn't this build already been shown here?

Anyway it's a good build and I use to use it, but you have to be very aware of the map because if the zerg randomly builds like 30 speedlings and runs in to your third before cannons get up he will kill your sentries and cancel your third. That's what use to happen to me sometimes anyway. I think you really need to watch for his production in order to identify whether you can safely take your third off pure sentry or not.

Also I don't think you should be cutting probes at all with this build, oversaturation isn't bad on 2 bases if you're just going to transfer to your third anyway.

Basically to summarise I think the weakness of this build IS actually a stephano type player, a lot of zergs will see stargate and tech but some might just ignore the stargate play build a lot of roaches and lings and kill you, it can be iffy trying to hold his attacks unless you have good ffs and simcity and the map really favors a fast third.

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by pezzaperry

Hasn't this build already been shown here?

Anyway it's a good build and I use to use it, but you have to be very aware of the map because if the zerg randomly builds like 30 speedlings and runs in to your third before cannons get up he will kill your sentries and cancel your third. That's what use to happen to me sometimes anyway. I think you really need to watch for his production in order to identify whether you can safely take your third off pure sentry or not.

Also I don't think you should be cutting probes at all with this build, oversaturation isn't bad on 2 bases if you're just going to transfer to your third anyway.

Basically to summarise I think the weakness of this build IS actually a stephano type player, a lot of zergs will see stargate and tech but some might just ignore the stargate play build a lot of roaches and lings and kill you, it can be iffy trying to hold his attacks unless you have good ffs and simcity and the map really favors a fast third.

That style isn't the same that style is all about surviving until the colossus is out off 3 base. I also didn't base my style off it. If the lings are killing your 3rd you are making it too soon i was testing taking a faster 3rd out vs ninja who crushed it you really need the 6 gates with that 1st immortal before you take the 3rd.

you don't have to cut probes i just find focusing on army and getting a few cannons and the nexus up fasters is better. By all means try it your way I'm not saying everyone should be playing this way. I meary giving you an option of a certain style you can use.

The weakness of my build is your limitations and positioning. If you have bad forcefields you will lose anyway its how protoss works. This style works vs everything if you react to it right and back yourself. You also seem to miss the point in the immortals. Going fast colossus takes ages aswell as they are such a huge investment to generally not much return until you have a few of them. My way of dealing with this is getting blink immortal aswell as a 7th-8th gate(i immortals). Stephano style is kinda what I want them to do. a lot of zergs will see stargate and tech ok even if they do you are aswell its not like your going im going stargate im all in. The point in the stargate is to deny scouting aswell as saying if you make a **** ton of roaches im going to kill them eventually aswell it's on me how well i hold them off with forcefields which in my case are generally pretty good. well that and if they don't have defence you can do some economic damage.

I'm not saying this is the best style im meary giving an option on how to play stargate tech and how I'm doing it

Quick Comments

PiG:

great response. and yes immortals + good FF > stephano style

[nirvAnA]

Stally people are unconvinced. You need those replays vs PiG, EdgE and other top zergs up!

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by nirvAnA

Stally people are unconvinced. You need those replays vs PiG, EdgE and other top zergs up!

ok il link them now

edit: Done ^_^

[SLCN.NXZ]

As a Zerg stargate play is my least favorite thing to play against, u lose all map vision which, in my opinion, is the strength of the Zerg race. The fact that it transitions into colossus to mitigate hydras and has phoenix out to discourage muta, is also really clean and efficient. The ability to deny the 4th and harass and get a few free overlords is just the icing on the cake. I think stallion plays it intelligently, personally I consider most of the players he takes out to have superior mechanics but the way he uses his units and builds his composition makes huge sense and makes me very afraid to play him.

However it is true that 12 min max roaches can be an issue but what people don't know is that it is a attack that is completely based off exploiting your opponents pressure or lack thereof. For example, sending out a zealot stalker clearing the watch towers then poking forward a little before clearing the hell out, does not cost toss much but even if zerg reacts perfectly it delays their max by I'd say at least 30 seconds or maybe even a minute. You stop zerg from making drones before he's basically saturated and congratulations you've shut down max roach styles (assuming you can split your army well and forcefield decently). The roach max can still be very scary but with a voidray out, putting a timer on the roaches and immortals besting it up you should be able to keep your third alive and should be at least on even footing with Zerg.

Lastly, I'd like to note that stallion plays a little passive with his air, doing this allows him to macro efficiently and focus on bolstering his forces rather than injuring his opponent's. Naturally as you get better and better you can tax your apm to do more harass (another benefit of stargate play; the skill cap is enormous) and get yourself more advantages. The fact that stallion can play and not to much direct damage is a huge testament to the build. As a Zerg playing against stallions harass is manageable, (don't want to take away from stallions ability as a player but he doesn't make me fear for my life like other stargate players) but his strategy is a pain to deal with. Basically, YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE MC OR GENIUS TO EXCEL WITH THIS STYLE.

Ok I'm tired, night

Hope u guys enjoy my wall of text.

Quick Comments

	Stallion:	excatly <3 gosu nxz
	xGKingdelete:	i am convinced
	asdfSchnitzel:	I likeda wall of text XD

[PiG]

Originally Posted by aLtNXZ

As a Zerg stargate play is my least favorite thing to play against, u lose all map vision which, in my opinion, is the strength of the Zerg race.

supa high lvl zergies keep there lings running past the VRs to check whats going on . Taxes lots of apms tho!


RE: hydras vs immortals. Watch cruncher vs idra lol! extreme example but still :P