[Roz]

Ok so here is what happened in the Masters Cup. I was in the semi finals along with Targa, Indy and Yekke... all of which agreed that it would be ok for me to delay my game and play a few hours later because it is mother's day and i had to go out for dinner. The admins knew about it, they said as long as the other players are ok with it then it is fine.

So admins said it was ok, players left in the tourney knew about it and was ok. I went out for dinner and then i got walked over. Call this QQ-ing if you want because yes i am not very happy about it. I would have been fine if they told me that if i go for dinner i would get walked over. I would have accepted that but not this, tell me they can delay and then walk over? Please if you are gonna host a tourney, do it properly.

If the words of an admin isn't good enough in a tournament then what is? I understand that you are trying to help the community in hosting these but when things are ran like this, i really doubt the goal and results are the same.

[Meatex]

Sorry to hear about that Roz and I can understand your frustration
Though if Eddie was involved i'm sure he had good reason and only gave you the walk over begrudgingly
if thats any consolation

[deL]

Did you specify how long your delay was for, or did they say how long you were allowed to be away for? If they were under the impression you'd be like 30mins to an hour and then you were away for 2-3 hours it might be understandable.

[Roz]

yes i did tell them how long it would take and when i would be back

[deL]

In that case I think it is the responsibility of the admin to not make that call in the first place if they don't have the last say or they will have to walk you over. Once they made the call however I think the right move would have been to wait or ask the remaining players if they could reschedule to the next night O_O

[Roz]

Yea that's why i just find the whole thing very silly. They told me that they can't delay the whole tournament when i found out i got walked over =.=

[Roz]

all the players left in the tournament knew about it, they were all ok with it...zzz

[Xeen]

There was very little delay going into the finals game, which tells me that admins made the decision on the spot or pretty close to it. The fact that you were not informed of this directly and immediately is rather unsettling.

I wanted to cast your games, too.

[zendex]

The player replacement thing is retarded. Just don't put a cap and put a solid deadline for player registration.

[Mezza]

Correct me if I'm wrong. From what I gather from the chatbox messages, there was more than one admin involved and the final decision made by the admin/admins is a different one from what the first admin told you, Roz?

If such is the case, I'd suggest for future tournaments and in cases where stuff falls out of the boundaries of the rulebook, we have a head admin where his word is final, and unless the decision was run by him, to not take the word of the non head-admin as final.

If I was erroneous in my assumptions then you have my apologies. However I'd like to add that I believe the mods/admins from this site would have given due consideration to all issues before making the walkover decision.

I understand where you're coming from Roz, and it truly is unfortunate that instead of having a game which I'm sure everyone would have liked to watch (as Xeen has lent support to in his post), there was a walkover in its place.

Now in defence of the decision for having a walkover, here's some food for thought. I believe this event was a TL.net calendar event with a caster link, and yes, there was a significant prize pool for it and there's a couple of people who are involved in putting it together, volunteering to spend their own free time to do it.

Which leads to the question of how far would an admin go to change everyone's schedules/timings, abandon viewers on the stream and expect them to log in later to watch the end of the tournament or have players wait for a postponed outcome before they can go on to play their next round, etc.

These aren't easy decisions for an admin to make, and unfortunately its also not a decision that can be please all parties involved. When you give players/admins more autonomy, we're able to be more flexible with making decisions, but this comes at the cost of issues such as this particular one that Roz has raised (and unfortunately, it hasn't been the first time). Alternatively, we could have gone all badass about it and laid out ground rules and followed them strictly, but I'm sure that's not ideal in community tournaments, though this may need to be changed with the addition of prize pools and perhaps even factor in the size of the prize pool.

So as much as I'm all for trying to be flexible and accommodating everyone, I'd like to appeal to one and all to respect the final decision of the admin/s once its made. Hey, after all this guy's doing it out of his own free will/time/effort/pocket.

Quick Comments

Paroxysm:

Exactly what most people are thinking!

[nirvAnA]

+1 to everything mezza said

and that was probably a miscommunication with the other admins helping as the head admin Eddie seemed quite clear on his stance in that chatbox yesterday. roz you need to specifiy names and who exactly you talked to etc. i understand why he couldnt allow a postponement cause of the logistical reasons, so the problem to focus on is why you were told A but instead B ended up happening.

eddie has done an extremely good job over these months hosting the tournaments every week out of his own time, and even sponsoring the prizes out of his own pocket so yes i think your last paragraph needs to take that into consideration and is a bit too harsh.

when eddie posts his reply in this thread we can re-evaluate what happened and ill probably close the thread and we can all move on.

[Eddie]

I am sorry you are upset Roz, but also a little confused and disappointed.

I can't understand how a player could expect to delay a massive tournament, when they were aware they had to go out before joining?

I asked how long you would go out for you said 2.5 hours, this was far to long. We couldn't just sit around and wait, we'd have to stop the tournament/stream/lose all our viewers, many of which from TL. We had something like 930+ last night, was great.

You asked if it was ok to play later, i replied probably foreit since only a semi final. I asked if you'd like me to ask the players if they'd wait for the 3rd place match, since it only worth $10, and doesn't get streamed. I asked for you, turned out to be NEOIndy, he agreed. Up to you if want to play it, but from chat it now appears not? If so i'll give you until the end of the day, if not Indy can take 3rd. You asked the players about the semi on your own, not my idea, i said it was doubtful. Then you had to leave, which is unfortunate.

Your not the only person who had to leave/withdraw for mothers day, but we cannot stop the whole tournament and start up again the next day. Not fair on the 100+ players, 900+ viewers, admin, casters and sponsors.

Sorry about the confusion. I thought i was clear not semi, i'd ask about 3rd for you.

Masters Cup is on every 4 weeks, plenty of chances for someone of your skillset to make the finals.

[Unstable]

Roz,

While i understand your frustration. something keeps nagging at me.

Why did you sign up to a tournament that you knew you couldnt complete? You have been around long enough to know how long tournaments go for, and that Streamed/TL linked events are very rarely put on hold just for a few games.

[Roz]

Originally Posted by Eddie

I am sorry you are upset Roz, but also a little confused and disappointed.

I can't understand how a player could expect to delay a massive tournament, when they were aware they had to go out before joining?

I asked how long you would go out for you said 2.5 hours, this was far to long. We couldn't just sit around and wait, we'd have to stop the tournament/stream/lose all our viewers, many of which from TL. We had something like 930+ last night, was great.

You asked if it was ok to play later, i replied probably foreit since only a semi final. I asked if you'd like me to ask the players if they'd wait for the 3rd place match, since it only worth $10, and doesn't get streamed. I asked for you, turned out to be NEOIndy, he agreed. Up to you if want to play it, but from chat it now appears not? If so i'll give you until the end of the day, if not Indy can take 3rd. You asked the players about the semi on your own, not my idea, i said it was doubtful. Then you had to leave, which is unfortunate.

Your not the only person who had to leave/withdraw for mothers day, but we cannot stop the whole tournament and start up again the next day. Not fair on the 100+ players, 900+ viewers, admin, casters and sponsors.

Sorry about the confusion. I thought i was clear not semi, i'd ask about 3rd for you.

Masters Cup is on every 4 weeks, plenty of chances for someone of your skillset to make the finals.

I dont really think anyone really cares about playing for 3rd, at least not me and not indy. Whether it was fair or not was not the issue here. If u are talking about fair, then it wouldn't be fair to me if anything. You can say that all you said was only for 3rd place, but we all know that was not what went across as i did confirm with you as well. Why would i tell u that EVERYONE including targa was ok with waiting if i was playing for 3rd place? He was my opponent in semis and there was absolutely no chance for me and him to be playing each other for 3rd place. Whatever, what's done is done, i know what was typed to me and so does people in my clan as i copy and pasted to show them while talking to them too.

Also what you said was not to have me forfeit. What was said to me was that if not ALL players are ok with delaying the game, would i still want to play for 3rd place. And it turned out that all players were ok with it and hence what you said earlier to me doesn't even need to be considered.

Originally Posted by Unstable

Roz,

While i understand your frustration. something keeps nagging at me.

Why did you sign up to a tournament that you knew you couldnt complete? You have been around long enough to know how long tournaments go for, and that Streamed/TL linked events are very rarely put on hold just for a few games.

Because on the sign up page it said that signs up will close at 3pm and the tournament brackets will be posted right after. So i assumed the tourney was starting at 3pm but instead it started at 4 and my match started even at 4:30pm. So in some ways that was kinda my fault. I could have stayed a little longer to play but i knew i wouldn't finish the finals at that point if i wanted to be on time for dinner. However, what im getting to here is that if i was told i had to forfeit, then i would make the choice of being late or just forfeiting and that would have been ok. I dont know which i would have done but i would have probably stayed because my sisters were gonna be late for dinner anyways. I only went out a bit earlier than i even needed to because i was told that as long as everyone was ok then the match could be delayed, hence there was no reason for me to even risk being a little late for mother's day dinner so i just went out.

[Eddie]

Originally Posted by Roz

I dont really think anyone really cares about playing for 3rd, at least not me and not indy.

That's your decision. I know it's not really worth it money wise, only $10, but you do get to be outright 3rd in a big tournament, and have that on your record, stats sites, and hall of fame.

Originally Posted by Roz

You can say that all you said was only for 3rd place, but we all know that was not what went across as i did confirm with you as well.

Confirm what exactly? I never said ok Roz, you'll be vsing ? in the semi, we'll stop the tournament and you can play at a time later at your choosing.

What i said was probably forfeit final, i'll ask the players about 3rd for you.

You asked all the players on your own reasoning. I never spoke to them, other than Indy for third. They would all confirm this.

Originally Posted by Roz

Why would i tell u that EVERYONE including targa was ok with waiting if i was playing for 3rd place? He was my opponent in semis and there was absolutely no chance for me and him to be playing each other for 3rd place.

You did say they would be ok with it, but that's not the point, i didn't confirm with them or you saying we'd stop the tournament.

Originally Posted by Roz

Whatever, what's done is done, i know what was typed to me and so does people in my clan as i copy and pasted to show them while talking to them too.

I also have a copy? Please read again, like i posted above, i said forfeit semi, up to players about 3rd, i'd ask for you. You were the one pushing about it being all your clan mates, they'd stop, you'd ask, etc. I agreed it would be ok for 3rd place.

Originally Posted by Roz

Also what you said was not to have me forfeit. What was said to me was that if not ALL players are ok with delaying the game, would i still want to play for 3rd place. And it turned out that all players were ok with it and hence what you said earlier to me doesn't even need to be considered.

If you forfeit, which you'd have to if leave, you'd still be in 3rd place match, but that only $10, would u want me to ask to wait for that one as well?

Roz, i never agreed to anything other than asking about 3rd for you.

I did consult with other admin and Benji about delaying your semi, but reasons mentioned in earlier posts, we decided wasn't fair, or practical to do. You'd already left.

Again sorry about the confusion. I'd suggest only joining tournaments if prepared to play to the end or leave. Think most would agree.

[Roz]

The fact is that i wasn't NOT prepared to play to the end, i asked if it was possible to delay. If the answer given was a no, then if i choose to forfeit then i would accept that. If i chose to stay, which i most likely would have then that just means i decided to be late for dinner. But the answer given was not that, i left EARLIER than i should have because it was fine as long as players were ok. Apparently not i suppose.

I told you that most of them should be ok given that 3 outta 4 of the semi finalist were in inFi. I did ask them personally as well and they said they were ok. So you had me ask them just so i can know, not because it does anything......right......

Also, like i said, i never said that i wouldn't try to finish the tournament if i had to. The idea here is that it was OK to delay it if the players were OK with it, hence why i left earlier.

What you are saying here doesn't even make sense. You had me ask all the players, had me tell benji as well. I did exactly all that, i told you everyone was ok with it, then i told you when i would be back and when everyone could play. I told you i'll be back in 2.5 hours to play and u're like ok. I ended the convo with sorry for the delay and thx. I dont know what you were doing because you're giving me the idea you had no idea what was going on.

[Eddie]

I never asked you to ask them Roz. That was all your doing/idea.

Never meant Semi, or said so. Meant 3rd, though i made that clear, sorry if not. Was hard to confirm however since you left.

Sorry about the confusion.

Can't really stop and start 1 day tournaments. I'm trying to run enjoyable tournaments for all players and viewers, and can't really stop and start whenever one player has to leave. 2.5 hours is far to long. Sorry if you feel hard done by, not my intention at all. Would have loved to see you win actually.

Don't think i can really say more, seems we going in circles here. Sorry dude.

Quick Comments

nirvAnA: