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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 9:59 AM Who's Who:   BnetId: Dox.792  Race: Location: Brisbane  Total Posts Made: 2,980 # 1
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OSL makes permanent shift to SC2

We're gonna be seeing GSL and ProLeague stars go head to head in OSL pretty soon! Exciting stuff, Korea is really starting to boom with SC2 now.

Shameless re-post from TL:
Quote:
  • After 13 years of history and 34 editions, Tving StarLeague 2012 will be the last BroodWar OSL
  • Starting next season, OSL will be a SC2 league
  • Both KeSPA players and original SC2 players will be able to participate in this new league

EDIT: Let me clarify. Direct quote from the original source:
+ [Korean] +
스타크래프트2로 새롭게 시작할 스타크래프트2 리그는 현재 KeSPA 소속 프로게이머들 뿐만 아니라 GSL과 해외 리그서 뛰고 있는 선수들이 모두 참가해 우열을 겨루게 된다.


It literally means "In this new SC2 league will participate not only KeSPA progamers but players competing in GSL and foreign leagues as well."

- The preliminaries for the first SC2 OSL will start mid-July

EDIT: In addition to the "end of an era" discussion growing in this thread, I just wanted to include this quote from a Reddit user:
Quote:
Like doomed amphibians unaware of water that gradually begins to boil, I believe that the StarCraft 2 community has slowly become accustomed to such high-level play that it seems few people have noticed (or at least verbalized) how far SC2 has come. I want to try and put into words how great I think SC2 is right now, if you'll bear with me.
In the beginning, we saw an amazing variety of playstyles, builds, and compositions. We enjoyed watching players explore this wonderful game as a standard metagame was being discovered. This process of discovery led to many games where one engagement or one major mistake decided the match. We saw this so often that we even questioned if this is what SC2 was going to be: one deathball vs. another deathball followed by A-moving for victory. Those of us loyal to SC2 continued to believe while our game was made out to be inferior to Broodwar. Even our players were accused of being scrubs, b-teamers, mere rodents amongst the elephants of the "true" eSport.
As maps changed and Blizzard patched, each matchup evolved and players grew in understanding. Slowly, SC2 was becoming understood at a truely deep level which allowed for the development of a very standard metagame. With the flow of each matchup relatively mapped out, deviations can occur while remaining safe. This is what I think has all but eliminated the "one engagement and A-move" games we used to see so much of. Our players have become very good at staying safe while taking map control, harassing, and taking little advantages. Our players know where to engage and where not to and how to respond in countless situations. Players of all three races are now able to determine when and where they can trade armies and how that will affect what they can do next. To put it simply, SC2 is becoming the game we knew it could: a back-and-forth, action-packed, skill-based RTS.
This has all become very obvious to me while watching the SPL. Like I said before, our players have become so good at such a gradual curve that I barely noticed just how good they really are. Watching the SPL has brought back all the old memories of SC2. Protoss seems to have A-move domination, nearly every game is won or lost in the early-midgame, and it's usually just one engagement or mistake that ends the game rather quickly. These are the types of things that we questioned about SC2 back in the day. Is this just how the game is or is it only because the game is so young? Now, of course, we have the proof right in front of us. If you compare the SPL games with the GSTL games, it's like two completely different worlds, two completely different games. SC2 is not a game that just any talented player can pick up and be great at. Multiple-building selection and auto-mine rally points do not take away from this game, but add to it. A deep level of understanding and absolutely precise army control are paramount to winning games at the highest levels.
The faster action and better AI of SC2 means that the game is balanced on a very thin knife's edge. This is something that we did not understand early on. Why would some games end so quickly? Why would one battle decide an entire match? How can just one or two mistakes be punished so harshly? It is not a flaw of the game, but a strength. Our players are forced to play so well, to control their units so precisely, and to make such sound decisions because SC2 allows players to punish or be punished so quickly and decisively. To see so many games survive into the late-game after constant engagements and harrassment in modern SC2 play is a testament to player skill. It is also clear evidence that SC2 is well worthy of our attention and why it is the centerpiece of modern eSports.
I don't know if I've really said everything I wanted to say or how well I said it, but I think this stuff needs to be said. SC2 no longer lives in the shadow of BW, SC2 is no longer the second-tier of RTS games. I am not afraid to say it: StarCraft 2 is the greatest RTS of all time, and I believe that modern high-level SC2 play backs me up on that.
And some nice responses:

+ [Response 1] +
I still maintain that MBS and other things that make the game "easier" will, in the end, make it better. All the apm that went to doing those things in BW can now be focused on micro, multitasking, and multipronged attacks as well as some things we haven't even thought of yet. Watching games from GSL season 1 and now it is a shocking difference. The future is bright and very, very ******* exciting.


+ [Response 2] +
I've argued this in the past. BW is a great game, no doubt. However, it's a game that is riddled with flaws that somehow achieved cult status out of the admiration people have for its pros. The things that BW elitists love to circlejerk over (limited control groups, single building selection, retarded AI, no automatic worker rallying, etc.) are relics of poor game design. They are the purest definition of artificial difficulty. You are spending just as much effort fighting against the game's mechanics as you are against your opponent.
You can replace any of those things with something just as APM intensive and just as arbitrary. For example, suppose the game required you to click a button every 5 seconds to continue a building's production. Or how about rapidly mashing a button in order to "charge" a spell before it casts?


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Cool beans!
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sick as aids!
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Last edited by Dox; Wed, 6th-Jun-2012 at 11:30 AM.
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 10:11 AM BnetId: iVnChappo.904  Race: Clan: iVn  Location: Perth, Australia  Total Posts Made: 111 # 2
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"Both KeSPA players and original SC2 players will be able to participate in this new league"
I think that is huge. Ridiculously pumped
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 10:13 AM Who's Who:   BnetId: ToRErasmus.733  Race: Clan: ToR  Location: Sydney  Total Posts Made: 1,454 # 3
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This is huuuge... and very exciting. I do expect the GSL players to dominate at first, but the competition and just more leagues for the Kespa pros to practice for will help close the gap, I'm sure.
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 10:13 AM Who's Who:   BnetId: TAEdgE.100  Race: Clan: TA  Location: Adelaide, Australia  Total Posts Made: 956 # 4
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It's been so great to watch brood war over the years, and as much as I want it to stay on in a small way this was the only natural move unfortunantly(although the 50/50 Proleague season is quite weird to me.)

R.I.P Ongamenet Starleague!

One of my favorite moments to watch live - the rise of a legend:
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Great video
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 10:21 AM BnetId: AsGZealo.172  Race: Clan: AsG  Location: perth, australia  Total Posts Made: 607 # 5
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when is next season likely to start? will be funny to see how many of the current kespa players qualify if they have an open qualifier.

even though i've never really been a broodwar fan, i think it's kinda sad that there won't be any more major broodwar tournaments when the game still has such a large following.

EDIT: turns out i need more caffeine if i'm going to skip this much sleep AND function reasonably

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preliminaries are bolded in the OP
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i guess i need to learn how to play now...

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Last edited by Zealo; Wed, 6th-Jun-2012 at 11:43 AM.
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 10:25 AM Who's Who:   Race: Location: Adelaide, Australia  Total Posts Made: 1,638 # 6
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It's the end of an era, I loved Brood War so much but I can't help but be really excited about this shift to SC2.

SC2 is a brilliant game, and a fantastic spectator sport. I can't wait to see my Brood War heroes play SC2 fulltime. The thought of Flash, Effort, Jaedong, etc playing SC2 gave me chills back in the first year of GSL when Nada and Boxer were playing against eachother. This is a reality now. I am excite
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 12:04 PM BnetId: pyrox.385  Race: Clan: ToR  Location: India  Total Posts Made: 376 # 7
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o.0 A little sad...even though it was obvious that the switch was coming.

No bw osl for bisu!
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 12:08 PM BnetId: foxmeep.599  Race: Location: Canberra  Total Posts Made: 29 # 8
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Jaedong vs Iris, 2 control groups of mutas. That pretty much sums up why SC2 can never live up to the greatest moments in BW.

Edit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QHUB0DJj3A&t=8m29s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QHUB0DJj3A&t=8m29s


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In it's current state..but hopefully sc2 can improve.
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link!

Last edited by foxmeep; Wed, 6th-Jun-2012 at 10:31 PM.
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 12:29 PM Who's Who:   Clan: None  Location: Melbourne  Total Posts Made: 2,231 # 9
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That is a great speech, but i'm still going to miss broodwar
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 7:59 PM Location: Singapore  Total Posts Made: 283 # 10
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saddening. considering the history going away with it.
You Tube
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powerful imagery @2:16 footage of past winners followed by the camera pan @2:45 of the boxer, reach and yellow.

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sick video and sick song!
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 8:52 PM BnetId: Free. 749  Race: Clan: TN  Location: Singapore  Total Posts Made: 76 # 11
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Aww no more bw . T_T
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 9:20 PM BnetId: AsGScience.941  Race: Clan: AsG.  Location: Perth  Total Posts Made: 73 # 12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yongming View Post
saddening. considering the history going away with it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rS2xO2pTv08
powerful imagery @2:16 footage of past winners followed by the camera pan @2:45 of the boxer, reach and yellow.
The openings are what I'm really going to miss, I hope they don't cut down on the quality.

My favourite was the EVER OSL 2007 opening.

You Tube
You Tube

Hopefully the BW pros will fix up their play, now that they don't have to split their time to practise for the ridiculous format that Season 1 has had.
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 10:45 PM BnetId: foxmeep.599  Race: Location: Canberra  Total Posts Made: 29 # 13
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I really hope this brings the sort of prestigious tournament that I feel that SC2 is currently lacking. GSL is great and all, but it just happens all too often to keep my interest up. OSL/MSL were great because your favourite players only had one chance to win every 4 months.
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 11:03 PM Race: Clan: ToR  Location: Gosford  Total Posts Made: 309 # 14
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That second response makes me mad because it is so wrong.

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its like saying olympic 100m are outdated because men discovered automobile.
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Yeah the dude has nfi
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Unread Wed, 6th-Jun-2012, 11:34 PM BnetId: fur 282  Race: Location: Melbourne  Total Posts Made: 303 # 15
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Broodwar is and always will be the greatest RTS of all time. That being said, it is quite played out. The golden age is long since over.

I moved on years ago, but this news does make me a sand panda. Parting is such sweet sorrow.
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