[PapaBigBelly]

There are many ways us Starcraft 2 players train to improve. The reason to improve may vary, however we all strive to accomplish it. So how do you train?

[iM yang]

I do every single one of those and I recommend everybody to do them, depending on your mood.

I personally like customs with friends better than me who can pick up on the bigger flaws in my game.

Quick Comments

Zealo:

i was going to say the same thing

[Next_rim]

1) Ladder
2) Keep track of wins and losses to pin-point weak maps and matchups
3) Watch own replays with focus on precise things, adjust builds
4) Ladder

[TAXanT]

Laddering and watching back on replays to see what gave my opponent the edge that made him win. Also I watch my wins to see what I could of done better, bases I didn't scout, what I lacked, etc.

Eg: Did a FFE into mass blink stalkers vs a zerg the other day who had roaches with burrow and the upgrade so they can move underground. I destroyed his army JUST before burrow was completed and had no observer whatsoever on the field. Which I've noticed I forget regularly when I do the forge expand and don't go for robot tech.

But yeah, mainly I just keep laddering

[Aean(:]

Mass laddering. I dont think im at the stage where the other options will be too useful to me, im still learning heaps from self-evaluation in-game.

[SiZeMaTTeRs]

Laddering for me are practice matches

[scrawL]

spamming ladder games is a joke lol

[ToRPandarine]

Originally Posted by scrawL

spamming ladder games is a joke lol

tell that to Kas

[ROOT`iaguz]

Bit of everything. When I feel like I don't understand how to open in a matchup anymore I pop open a stream or some replays and watch until I like something I see. Then I play it out and see what happens.

Lots of laddering. On occasion someone like pig, light, jimdiddy or whoever asks for some practice matches. Those are good, but not part of my usual "how does I get this build and transitions to work"

Some thinking can come into it. Perhaps I like a certain early game or midgame look, like 2 factories in TvZ for hellions, making a few of them and then switching into 2 factory tanks for my pushes later on. Generally I notice these things when watching pr0 replays though, like "oh wow, he did this and this and now his medivacs are coming out a minute faster. I think I'll try that!", or "Oh damn MKP so sexy. Let's take his 1 base plays and terrorize protosses"

And after I see something I like, figure out how to open it, notice how they transition you jump on ladder and trial it a ton. Then figure out what else to use

[Unstable]

Originally Posted by iaguz

Lots of laddering. On occasion someone like pig, light, jimdiddy or whoever asks for some practice matches. Those are good, but not part of my usual "how does I get this build and transitions to work"

While you have a great mindset of practicing transitions, I feel you are under utilizing practice partners, ladder will never be as effective as correct practice with teammates/friends.

For example, you want to know build A vs reaction A,B,C,D,E so you practice 5 games, then you want to do the transition out of A. so then you have, A vs, A1,A2,A3 ALL of the different possibilities. You can grind this out in a day. This is how it is done because its the most effective, sure it sounds boring etc, but that's how when you see Koreans make instant decisions, its because they don't have to think they already have played every possible situations and practiced what the best response is.

Try the practice partner way and i guarantee your game will be boosted 100x higher. Even if you don't have a team to do it practice partners can be effective for this as well.

[ROOT`iaguz]

Originally Posted by Unstable

While you have a great mindset of practicing transitions, I feel you are under utilizing practice partners, ladder will never be as effective as correct practice with teammates/friends.

For example, you want to know build A vs reaction A,B,C,D,E so you practice 5 games, then you want to do the transition out of A. so then you have, A vs, A1,A2,A3 ALL of the different possibilities. You can grind this out in a day. This is how it is done because its the most effective, sure it sounds boring etc, but that's how when you see Koreans make instant decisions, its because they don't have to think they already have played every possible situations and practiced what the best response is.

Try the practice partner way and i guarantee your game will be boosted 100x higher. Even if you don't have a team to do it practice partners can be effective for this as well.

It's true that a dedicated team of practice partners who all play together and develop strategies and all that is effective. I think it's foolish to try and argue this with the coach of a team who did this and most probably did improve massively as a result of living together in Korea for a month or so. It's what the KOreans did in BW and SC2 and it's one big reason why they kill everyone.

But there's nothing wrong with thinking "hey this build might be fun" and throwing it out in the random swirling maelstrom of ladder games to see what happens to it when it is exposed to literally everything that can happen to it. Sometimes it's obvious "oh my blue flame drop tvp gets smashed if he opens Phoenix. That's quite obvious!", but there's also lots of subtleties that you can still get without having to grind out with specific people like "oh I"m adding marauders way too early into my TvT build" or "hey, this style looks like it'll be weak if I hit it like this".

And thanks to my KR account, I know I"ll never want for people of roughly equal or better skill value as me.

EDIT- one final thing. Ret said that most of his training for MLG and Bnet Euro invitational was ladder games with maybe some practice partnering. But he is Ret so w/e.

[Unstable]

Originally Posted by iaguz

It's true that a dedicated team of practice partners who all play together and develop strategies and all that is effective.

Don't forget, even with 1 or 2 ppl doing this you still get very effective practice, is it as good as a pro team environment? no. but its better than random laddering for sure!

Originally Posted by ke_ivan

The problem with this is that:
A) You need to have a practice partner;
B) You need a practice partner who understands the different builds well enough to help you;
C) You need a practice partner mechanically strong enough to execute those builds.

While your correct is you need a practice partner, its not a 1 way affair when it comes to practicing with someone, your points B and C can work effectively for both people, so they both get better at said strategy (works so much better for zerg players than other races) being on the receiving end of this practice too.

but overall remember, you dont NEED a pro team to do this, sure it will accelerate the process but even 1 practice partner can help be effective too.

[ke_ivan]

Originally Posted by Unstable

Don't forget, even with 1 or 2 ppl doing this you still get very effective practice, is it as good as a pro team environment? no. but its better than random laddering for sure!




While your correct is you need a practice partner, its not a 1 way affair when it comes to practicing with someone, your points B and C can work effectively for both people, so they both get better at said strategy (works so much better for zerg players than other races) being on the receiving end of this practice too.

but overall remember, you dont NEED a pro team to do this, sure it will accelerate the process but even 1 practice partner can help be effective too.

The thing is, you need a very good partner for this, because if you get an inferior partner, then your timings will be all wrong . Am I right to assume this?

[ke_ivan]

Originally Posted by Unstable

While you have a great mindset of practicing transitions, I feel you are under utilizing practice partners, ladder will never be as effective as correct practice with teammates/friends.

For example, you want to know build A vs reaction A,B,C,D,E so you practice 5 games, then you want to do the transition out of A. so then you have, A vs, A1,A2,A3 ALL of the different possibilities. You can grind this out in a day. This is how it is done because its the most effective, sure it sounds boring etc, but that's how when you see Koreans make instant decisions, its because they don't have to think they already have played every possible situations and practiced what the best response is.

Try the practice partner way and i guarantee your game will be boosted 100x higher. Even if you don't have a team to do it practice partners can be effective for this as well.

The problem with this is that:
A) You need to have a practice partner;
B) You need a practice partner who understands the different builds well enough to help you;
C) You need a practice partner mechanically strong enough to execute those builds.

So, for example, you want to play a TvT. You want to practice build A. That person will have to know how:
A) Build A works;
B) Have Build A1, A2, A3 etc.
C) Know how those builds unfold into late or end game
D) Mechanically execute those builds on your level of play.

Damn that's asking a lot! :O This is only available in a pro setting, I'm afraid. Unfortunately, I have to agree with Unstable.

I recommend playing by time or schedule. Like what so:

A) Play 2 hrs every day of the week for 5 days, using the same build (impt).
B) Take 1-2 hrs categorising play into race divisions and analysing that specific build against race match ups and what you can work on when going up against different builds.
C) Refine build.
D) Play again until comfortable.

This takes forever. But you will be very good at one build. For example, I always 1raxFE. Now, after a year of SC2, I know two branches of 1raxFE really well - 1raxFE into marine/tank and 1raxFE into marauder/ghost/viking. I know what to do for all-ins rushes, late game, research timings, attack timings, expansion timings etc. little things like that. So while I might be boring, I thoroughly understand my build and what to transition to in late game. I must've played 100 games with 1raxFE, and I still have problems with Protoss. It takes a while if you want to improve alone.

[Daboo]

I dont think there is one single way.

I'm not a high level player, I basically look at replays from big tourneys (MLG DH etc), and see if I can replicate them against the very easy AI, try to match the timings. And then If I feel confident about it I try to use it in the ladder, otherwise I play with it with clan people and see if it works, and if I like it, I take it to the ladder and try it out. At my league, if you can follow a build accurately, you can more or less win most ladder matches (hopefully I will be getting out soon ).

[Unstable]

Originally Posted by Daboo

I dont think there is one single way.

Context son! context, there is no single way to practice but there are proven better and more efficient ways to practice

[dippa]

press find game, go on win streak, feel good. press find game, going on losing streak, hit desk and feel suicidal. play last game of the day, win, feel good again.

repeat 24/7

Quick Comments

Nemo:

lol

[SkyBreaker]

I'm a bit of a mix-bag... I like to ladder as much as possible, study my own replays, watch replays of various high-level Protoss players, play customs against higher level players and tune into various streams; all while using an excel document for keeping track of my ladder performance and a notepad for keeping track of current issues and what not.

It seems to be working, but definitely could use some refinement.

[Malik]

mostly ladder but if there is a specific problem that i have identified then i will play a number of customs against people in order to figure out how to deal with it.

[Rythos]

My mechanics still need a lot of work, so I mostly just spam ladder games trying to improve the basics, with some YABOT sessions thrown in when I feel like I'm not executing a build correctly.