[mGGAequitas]

Lately in pvp I have been opening with phoenixes and it has been working well for me except against dt openers.

The build I lose to a lot is something like a 3gate dt and expand. (see here: http://drop.sc/208102)
I don't lose to the initial dts but I lose to a follow up attack with a couple of archons, zealots and stalkers. once I realize that theres an archon attack coming I try to get some voidrays but I just don't seem to have enough and I get steamrolled.

I also have a lot of trouble against a 1 base chargelot and 1 or 2 archons follow up.

How should you deal with those 2 follow up attacks after opening phoenixes?

[EsKy]

Scissor asking how to beat Rock?

[Stallion]

you should have a robo into your build by 40 supply even so a dt rush is a blind counter and thats why i don't generally stargate open. you can try to hold until an observer is out by putting your army on the ramp and hold positioning so they can't get past and forcefield til the obs it out. dt opening shouldn't really kill you unless you screw up.

[iM yang]

if you have trouble with archon busts, wall off with gateways.

you now have no trouble with archon busts

Quick Comments

TADivinity:

Protoss imba easy race ;)

[inFeZa]

You don't open robo and he warps in a DT.

Instant lose.
No re.

[xGKingdelete]

unfortunately, no matter what you do, you'll just be behind against that kind of opening. It's why many consider PvP coin flippy. You just have to accept the economic loss and get colossus and win that way. Have a second pylon so you can do a full walloff in the future.

Make sure you get a good scout and see whether he's going blink stalker or zealot archon. You should be able to win either way if you can live long enough to get double robo colossus.

Quick Comments

mGGAequitas:

thx :)

[ETL.ViTaL]

just lift up the dts with your phoenix's and keep them mid air until u can kill you opponent :P

Quick Comments

	SLCN.Kez:	http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/131/351/eb6.jpg?1307463786
	inFeZa:	Oh yeah just lift up the Dts you can't see.

[VB_Rhuubarb]

Regarding the zealot/archon followup, is there time for you to tech to dts if you scout no robo with the pheonix?

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by VB_Rhuubarb

Regarding the zealot/archon followup, is there time for you to tech to dts if you scout no robo with the pheonix?

you shouldn't be able to cos all stargate openers have a robo built into them for that reason so sts is gambling if your not going for them already

[SLCNPezz]

Originally Posted by SQL.Stallion

you shouldn't be able to cos all stargate openers have a robo built into them for that reason so sts is gambling if your not going for them already

No they don't.

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by pezzaperry

No they don't.

all good stargate opening do before 40 supply

[SLCNPezz]

Originally Posted by SQL.Stallion

all good stargate opening do before 40 supply

No they don't or they auto lose to stargate.

[deL]

If you need tips about facing a 1 gate DT opener with a four gate you should ask QEDFridge.

[Malice]

When I open stargate, generally, I'm chrono'ing stalkers out to take map control, and just enough so you can get to the opponents ramp. I check for a sentry by standing near the ramp, or if they drop a forcefield. A good sign of a DT opening is the lack of that sentry, get a robo immediately, but don't confuse a DT build with a fast blink build, if you see a bunch of stalkers, they're likely to be going for blink, which you'll need a robo for that anyway.

[Masterfuzzy]

Honestly i don't think you should ever open phoenix in PvP. Phoenixes make your army significantly weaker than the opposing army. You should just open gateway -> robo. The early obs helps you scout the DT's and essentially makes their opening pointless and gives you a tech advantage. The tech advantage lets you get the protoss ball faster, so you can deal with the "later push" easier. Your main problem is most likely your opening.

[x5.NotoriouS]

pretty damn hard to beat dt's with a pheonix opener. even if you get the quick robo for obs it will probably mean u are behind ur oponent on gates who will likely pressure with zealot/stalker whilst dts are attacking.

Best tip is to make a 2 gates wall so that if u must u can build a pylon to block dts /use forcefields to buy time.

[Myth.ZenAku]

My standard approach is after 2gates + stargate, drop robotics immediately as you have the extra money too anyways. Only issue is with gas timings as there have been a couple experiences I've had where dropping it too quick and not being able to crank out enough sentries at a very particular timing

[mopy]

The zealot archon follow to a dt opening is quite easy to deal with. You should be active with your pheonixs and scout for an expo. If there is no expo you should immediately start building a wall and mass up ranged units mostly stalkers, and tech towards collosus while using your phoenix to harass, scout ect. Play the game out go for the late game and you will be surprised how much damage phoenixes can do.

[DUCKVILLELOL]

My nix opening is gate/core/star/gate/forge :S I has cannon yay! I dunno if that helps at all though. :S

[SLCNPezz]

Don't listen to like 100% of the people in this thread saying that dt > stargate, they obviously HAVEN'T used stargate extensively enough to state their opinion.

The general gameplan is this: Scout with 1st phoenix, if twilight throw a robo down otherwise don't (going blind robo with a stargate is effing retarded and you just end up losing in a stargate mirror, don't listen to these guys). If you see the dt shrine you're gonna have to stall, get some sentries and ff the ramp while doing a triple pylon block on the top of your ramp. You should have way more than enough time. After this you just go into a 1base collosus push and you've won.

I'll give you a replay as proof.

http://drop.sc/209748

Also, just for further proof I won a pvp against a high masters player in ACL tourny last weekend phoenix vs dts. The only thing that is actually a blind counter is a 1gate dt expand using dts for defense purposes and for archons, as well as doing damage if there is no detection out.