[Hybrid]

Hey guys/girls,

I just want to get clarification on smurfing. Firstly i will say what i think it is, and any replies to discuss this can be posted below!

So my take on this is when: a higher level player is "pretending"to be of a lower league to be able to play against lower ranked players and take some easy wins.

As to why they do this i am not quite sure, maybe it is because they have trouble being the best at their current level, and need to make themselves feel better.

I am bringing this up as i was playing a silver player in the BSG to which he said GG and left before the match was over. I asked why and was told he was a smurf and consequently got DQ.

Next brings to me the BSG winner Hillboy, he played exceptionlly well for being in Bronze League, i am not saying he is masters league or anything, but played better than the gold players in the tournament. So would this be smurfing aswell since he is in bronze league and is most definately not a bronze league player?

It is infact hard to place him in a league since he does not ladder much at all. I myself think he would fit into high platinum or low diamond at a minimum, i mean since (BSG) he has won 3 games against a platinum player.

I am not trying to stir up trouble, i just think it is not an accurate representation of his skill level and as such when they completely outplay everyone is the BSG makes it hard to not think otherwise when they are seen as a bronze league player.

I had questioned this at the time after i got completely railed by him, and was told "aslong as he is below gold it is ok". Which brings me to what happened to the silver league player i played against who got DQ.

I think we should have an accurate representationof people who enter a tournament, If you play lots of custom games you are not ranked accordingly which is the case of Hillboy, and if anyone who plays outside of their league ranking/expectation is going to cause some questions, this is meant to be a fun thing for lower ranked players and when u get the floor mopped with yourself by a player who should not be at that level of play according to their league division should be looked into.

I think that this is indeed a form of smurfing as his actual league division is not represented by his actual skill level, and until this is rectified is going to cause questions from people. In the coming months if this is going on i can see this site/tournament losing creditability for hosting such tournaments and not policing things properly, hence people may stop entering these as people can get away with cheating the system you have in place.

I am not saying to DQ Hillboy, i would just like to see people who play be in a division that accuratly represents their current skill level, as without that makes it very hard to justify that you are in a BSG level when u completly outplay everyone in it, not just beat them.

I would just like to add that on review of my match with Hillboy, i think there may be reason to say he may of actually been listening to the stream, as at the very start about 7 seconds in he looks directly to where i have spawned and this is announced on the stream by Benji, so it is possible he may have been listening whilst we were playing. I have been told it is possible to listen and not be logged in and you won't be seen as listening, i am not 100% about this though.

Sorry to bring this up, it is just things don't add up.

[Benji]

I personally think all the talk of smurfing etc detracts from the tournament itself. The tournament is a fun way for some BSG level players to get some fun games in, as well as some advice via the stream.

Everyone accusing everyone of smurfing is getting very old and makes people look childish. If someone IS smurfing, its usually obvious and they are picked up around the Semis/Finals via the stream.

[ToRDeathsFang]

Well you are right it is incredibly easy to be on the stream and not logged in as on Justin.tv you can view streams but not chat in them while you are watching. It is possible that he was stream-hacking as most people call it.

It is extremely hard to judge these things but just saying that he doesn't ladder much and that he is too good for the bronze league isn't really a valid arguement.

[Satu]

The guy you played who got DQ'd is gunduii. He got DQ'd not because we think hes an awesome player, but because hes a diamond level player on the NA server. Hes most famous around here for beating nGenLight in one of the Community Opens. The one that I hosted.

The standard of BSG winners usually is about platinum level, tbh. But we cant really do much about that. We can only disqualify players that we believe are much higher than BSG level. The difference between gold and platinum players shouldn't be that huge either.

[Hybrid]

You can see the way he plays and micros his units that he is far better than bronze league, you can usually tell a bronze league player from a gold or above, look at how many different builds he has used, how many lower level/league people can do that/or do that? often it is just 1 or 2 builds.

It is hard to judge with only playing customs, but beating a platinum player 3 games in a row should be some indication. and TBH when the player got DQ against me, i found Hillboy to have played alot better IMO on that night. I just find it odd that everyone he play was seriously outplayed, not just beaten because they are slightly better than you.

I think itis smurfing all the same if you are in bronze and play at a higher level, very hard to determine with out him playing another 50 ladder games though.

Anyway i wanted to say this

[Satu]

If you're that worried, hes lower ranked on NA than he is on SEA.

He has master league friends that he trained with though. Ladder-wise, he hasn't gotten anywhere. But skill wise hes platinum at least.

Also, beating platinums on customs doesn't mean much. Hell, I beat a master league player in a custom once. I've also beat platinums and diamonds more than i can count in customs. Does this mean Im an exceptional player? No.

We pretty much have to accept that the finals of the BSG have players of platinum standard. Its been like that since the first BSG.

[DRFT]

I wish i didnt hav a sea account. I would hav done the exact same thing as this hillside chap.

[DRFT]

I shall learn how not to make silly accusations

[ToRDeathsFang]

@ DRFT-Again more trolling by DRFT...People like BoxeR are on the verge of hitting Platinum, he has more-than-likely received training or something and has just not laddered enough to get promoted. Of course now that the ladder is frozen noone can get promoted/demoted.

[SkyBreaker]

Benji pretty much hit the nail on the head. When Nirvana and I first begun organising the BSG Open for sc2sea.com, we did it with the vision of opening up a form of e-sports for the lower league players who weren't quite ready to compete with SC2's big-dogs from the CO, or any of the other tournaments that were open to higher league players. The live-stream, casting and prizes were all added in to cater to help the BSG players improve their game, and perhaps one day make it to the higher leagues where they would be confident competing in the other tournaments on sc2sea.

IMHO, there has been about two higher-league smurfs throughout the life of the BSG Open (Hillboy not being one of them), whilst all other accusations of smurfing have come from a couple of players who are generally BM and get extremely sour over losing. Of course people could listen into the stream while playing; perhaps even invite an observer who will feed them information - but due to this tournament being run the way it is, it's up to the players to make it an honest tournament, and you'd hope they would have the decency not to ruin the fun for everyone else. I guess some players are just too obsessed with winning rather than learning; hence while you'll see things like smurfs, as well as people opting to use a "cheese" strategy instead of actually trying to improve and get better at the game.

In the coming months if this is going on i can see this site/tournament losing creditability for hosting such tournaments and not policing things properly

Highly doubtful, in my opinion. The tournament organisers do as much as humanely possible in order to weed out potential smurfs throughout this tournament and we hope that the SCII community understand this; and ultimately understand things like this can happen from time-to-time, especially in a tournament aimed at the lower league players.

[cure]

Originally Posted by DeathsFang

@ DRFT-Again more trolling by DRFT...People like BoxeR are on the verge of hitting Platinum, he has more-than-likely received training or something and has just not laddered enough to get promoted. Of course now that the ladder is frozen noone can get promoted/demoted.

Ladder isn't frozen yet (:

[NvPinder]

whoa whoa whoa, smurfing is simply playing on an account other than your own so no one knows its you, imo there's nothing wrong with smurfing, in fact i smurfed a lot in bw and have a bit insc2 as well...

when smurfing becomes a problem is when someone jumps on a smurf account to play the BSG tournaments etc when they're actually in >platinum...

So anyway, that's your question answered, smurf simply means a player who is hiding his identity while playing.

[Aean(:]

Hillboy isn't a smurf. Ive played him in semi finals, he beat me 2-0. Im a rank 1 gold (at the time, now plat). He is not over gold.

[MKP]

lol... for god's sake. i guess you are writing this becos u r unhappy that u have lost and u wanna voice out u hate smurfs.
get this. there will be smurfs in every tournament. tht is how it goes. use the smurfs to help u improve. dun sorta like complain. LOL
i have seen smurfs b4 and i dun come here to say tht i saw a smurf and tht the tourney shud dq him. justshut up and learn to play the game like unstable will say. QQing wont help in any case. LOL make yrself better and dun come here and QQ

[x5_Potter]

All I can say is... QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ

[ToRDeathsFang]

Imagine a smurf in the GSL...

(Yes,i know its not possible)

[Jaii]

Smurphing is fine. In fact it is downright useful! I bought a second account to learn to play protoss and terran on, and to use to roadtest crazy zerg ideas. This works out great as my toss and terran are both about low diamond (I dont even know basic openers!), making it a perfect playground for crazy-idea roadtesting.

BUT the line is drawn at wankers who use smurf accounts (or rating tank, essentially the same thing) just to play in a skill-capped tournament. I would never consider playing my diamond account in the GPD, even on my legitimate diamond-skill-level races. It is cheating the terms of the tournament and a downright disgraceful thing to do. Community bans for proven offenders IMHO

[Makra]

Originally Posted by SkyBreaker

Highly doubtful, in my opinion. The tournament organisers do as much as humanely possible in order to weed out potential smurfs throughout this tournament and we hope that the SCII community understand this; and ultimately understand things like this can happen from time-to-time, especially in a tournament aimed at the lower league players.

Could you please reveal the measures taken by the TO's that you're talking about? If they are as extensive as you make out, it should hopefully put everyones mind to rest. However, I suspect they aren't that extensive, as I seemed to be the only one to check the match histories of a few people I suspected to not be BSG, who were consequently DQ'ed I believe, back in BSG 6 or so.

One way or another, smurfs are always going to be able to sneak their way into the BSG, so lets just hope that they get bored of beating low level players or grow up.

[ProAnnn]

Originally Posted by Jaii

Smurphing is fine. In fact it is downright useful! I bought a second account to learn to play protoss and terran on, and to use to roadtest crazy zerg ideas. This works out great as my toss and terran are both about low diamond (I dont even know basic openers!), making it a perfect playground for crazy-idea roadtesting.

BUT the line is drawn at wankers who use smurf accounts (or rating tank, essentially the same thing) just to play in a skill-capped tournament. I would never consider playing my diamond account in the GPD, even on my legitimate diamond-skill-level races. It is cheating the terms of the tournament and a downright disgraceful thing to do. Community bans for proven offenders IMHO

I disagree with your statement. I actually and IN FACT joined GPD with my diamond account protoss since my protoss is ACTUALLY at a diamond level. I think it is legitimate to join GPD with a diamond acc on a different race since the level of play isnt very low and playing with an off-race at a diamond level is not cheating in the tournament. However, if you are at master level at zerg for example, and join GPD as zerg, i think it is cheating and smurfing and is really an offence. This is only in the case of GPD. Anyone above diamond SHOULD NOT smurf in BSG EVEN with their off-race since their mechanics EVEN with their off-race should be slightly above gold standard.

[ke_ivan]

Well, I know bronze players who've consistently beat silver and gold players. But also consistently lost to cheese in bronze. Sometimes, bronze players play really badly for say the first 200 games, for whatever reason, so even if they win against a higher ranked player, they stay in bronze. I think your win rate has to spike past 50% to get promoted. If you start winning say, 80% of your plays suddenly, but lost like 40 games, you'd still a) have to stabilise where you're at and have 40 wins, and b) you'll have to consistently win the next few games to push up your win percentage rating. You could foreseeably see a 1000 game bronze level player have fantastic understanding of his race and great mechanics, but he won't move beyond bronze until he's started winning games beyond 50%.