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Careers: Sports vs E-Sports Blog Options
New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011 3:30 AM
Makra Makra is offline
 
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Replies: 12
I've been skeptical about the whole 'E-Sports' idea for a while, and something just occurred to me to reinforce this. It concerns the difference between E-sports and other sports.

No regular sport is controlled and kept alive by a single company (afaik anyway). SC2 is the intellectual property of Blizzard, so they have complete control over it, and would be very unlikely to allow any infringement of their IP. Other sports however, are often universal, played around the world, and owned by no one. Both e-sports and other sports professionals dedicate themselves to their chosen pursuit, as it is their career and lifeblood. They put blood, sweat and tears into competing to be the best. However, is there a substantial difference between the usefulness and longevity of the skills acquired by e-sports players and other sports players, in terms of developing and maintaining a career?

I'm not at all familiar with how sports associations and leagues are structured business-wise, but let's propose a hypothetical situation:

Suppose the Football Federation of Australia shuts down due to a declining interest in soccer (football) in Australia. Let's say that because of this, there are no more professional soccer teams or leagues in Australia, and all full-time career players are out of a job. Have the players' years of training and effort been a complete waste of their time, leaving them unskilled and unable to get a decent job without further years of education/training? Well, potentially not. Why? Because the sport itself is still alive and the players may have the skills required to compete elsewhere.

But if Blizzard closed its doors in a year or two (or perhaps more realistically decided to cease support for SC2), what happens to those players who spent the last couple of years training full time in SC2? There's nowhere else for the players to go. Even if Blizzard kept the servers running, the ladders would become a cesspool of hackers and cheaters to the point where it would be totally unplayable. Due to Bnet 2.0 and lack of LAN, custom ladders such as ICCUP are out of the question. Blizzard totally controls SC2, and without their support, the game (and sport) dies. Due to SC1 and Brood War's longevity, people expect the same sort of longevity from SC2. However, Blizzard is under no obligation to continue support for the game, just as other games publishers decide to shut down servers when it's no longer profitable for them etc. Does that mean that a hundred or so professional SC2 players' lives are riding on the profits or business direction of Blizzard? With SC2 dead, would those players' years of training and effort have been a waste of time, leaving them without skills to continue their careers?

Let's take a look at EGIdrA. He moved to Korea when he was 17 or so. He lived there for the last few years, dedicating his life to professional Starcraft. Not only has he done nothing but train for professional gaming that whole time, but he is doing it at a critical moment in his life - the time when most people develop skills/knowledge which help initiate or develop their life-long career. He sacrificed a highly regarded position at one of America's best universities, because he loved starcraft so much. What would IdrA do if SC2 died? Sure, he's still very young, and could no doubt go to college and get a qualification. But it would leave a nasty stain on e-sports. IdrA is easily one of the most entertaining, and committed, SC2 players in the world - a great asset to the sport. For someone who has sacrificed so much, and put so much hard work, commitment and love (:P) into Starcraft 2, to be effectively kicked out of his profession would be a big set back for the development and image of e-sports. I think that it would certainly discourage future gamers from entering into a professional e-sports career, if they looked at the work that IdrA put in, and what he got back.

Edit: Ok wait. having rethought that, if SC2 died out prematurely, the plethora of committed players, not just IdrA, losing their job and career would leave an unforgettable mark, and forever scar e-sports. /edit

Sure, there are transferrable skills in video games. Perhaps IdrA and other players could pick up a new game. Many professional SC2 players came from WC3, BW, DoW etc, which are quite different games. But players still effectively have to learn a brand new sport, and dedicate a huge amount of time to adapting and learning new skills etc, which regular sports professionals wouldn't have to do.

Now, this discussion doesn't have to be about SC2. It could be about any E-sport, future or current, as the issues remain the same. i.e. Intellectual Property vs universality. E-sports careers vs sports careers. No professional sport would be successful without content participants. The fact that regular sports are universal and owner-less means the participants can see a future in their chosen area, without having to worry about whether their sport will even exist in a few years time.
E-sports careers on the other hand, seem to offer very little flexibility and longevity. Does this lack of certainty about the future of games and gaming careers make e-sports not viable in the long term?


p.s. I came into the world of starcraft after SC2 was released, so I'm fairly uneducated about SC1 and WC3. Also, I'm writing this late at night so I may not be thinking clearly :P Should this be in blogs btw? :/
Tags: e-sports sports careers

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Replies to Blog: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports
New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 5:59 AM BnetId: Dox.792  Race: Location: Brisbane  Total Posts: 2,980  # 1
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

You've made some great points, however this is probably the 50th blog I've seen which aims to point out the difference between regular sports and eSports, suggesting there should be fluid similarities between them. It's like saying a car and a plane should be the same because they both have wheels.

eSports is what it is, and just because it isn't built upon the same framework as football, hockey or tennis, doesn't mean that an eSports career (whether it be playing, commentating, administrating, or whatever) is doomed to fail.

I think you'll also find that the game is merely a platform. Just because SC2 dies, doesn't mean they won't successfully transition into the next big title. Look at mOOnGLaDe for example.

Having said that, I don't think you've been a member of the "Blizzard" community long enough to understand how much longterm support they deliver for each of their games. Did you know WarCraft 3 and Diablo 2 had new balance patches and ladder resets ~6 months ago? They also banned like another ~10,000 hackers for each game.

As far as monetary sustainability goes, that's anyone's guess. But eSports has made its splash, and it's here to stay.
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 9:03 AM BnetId: ToRErasmus.733  Race: Clan: ToR  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 1,454  # 2
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Ignoring the issue of Blizzard shutting down (and I don't see how that should cause the game to no longer be playable once the legalities of who is able to get licenses to host tournaments now that Blizzard no longer exists is sorted out) a lot of professional sportspeople are in the same boat as your example, IdrA.

Every professional athlete who sacrifices schooling to train harder to reach their goal runs the risk of some extraneous circumstances preventing them. It could just be an injury, but it's something outside their control. If it doesn't stop people dropping education to train 10 hours a day to become a professional footballer or tennis player, it probably won't stop people doing that to become professional gamers. And a lot of those people who sacrifice at least some education barely even make a living out of those sports (I mean, the fringe competitive tennis and golf players who travel around the world competing, but never get any big wins don't end up with a lot of money, and no qualifications or experience).

Other than the point about blizzard having a certain amount of control over the future of the game as an e-sport, you've really just pointed out how similar (and risky) attempting to make sacrifices to follow a dream of being a professional gamer is to being a professional athlete of any other kind can be.
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 11:56 AM BnetId: sKyAU.570  Race: Location: Sydney, Australia  Total Posts: 461  # 3
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

E-sports doesnt have much to offer compared to that of regular sports. Don't most starcraft progamers quit at the age of 25 or something due to not having as fast reflexes? 10-15hours a day practising a video game sitting down; regular sports provide long-term health benefits.
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 12:22 PM BnetId: Makra.969  Race: Clan: HT  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 200  # 4
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Thanks for the reply guys, puts things in a different light for me. Didn't realise there were a ton of these types of threads before either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dox
I think you'll also find that the game is merely a platform. Just because SC2 dies, doesn't mean they won't successfully transition into the next big title. Look at mOOnGLaDe for example.
Isn't it slightly concerning though that a large proportion of these e-sports platforms (SC2/WC3/WoW/Dota) are owned by one company? I know the chance of Blizzard suddenly closing down or switching industry are extremely slim, but theoretically that possibility is still there, and that creates a large amount of risk in the industry.

Quote:
Having said that, I don't think you've been a member of the "Blizzard" community long enough to understand how much longterm support they deliver for each of their games. Did you know WarCraft 3 and Diablo 2 had new balance patches and ladder resets ~6 months ago? They also banned like another ~10,000 hackers for each game.
Yes, you're right. I certainly didn't know they were providing that level of support for those games. I also don't know enough about BW and WC3 pro-gamers and how their e-sports careers have progressed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by |Erasmus|
I don't see how that should cause the game to no longer be playable once the legalities of who is able to get licenses to host tournaments now that Blizzard no longer exists is sorted out...
Are you referring to another company buying out the intellectual property rights of Blizzard? That was something I deliberately left out in favour of my example where Blizzard decides to cease support for the game, leaving them in control of the IP. If Blizzard did actually close down, then yeah other companies could buy out their IPs and keep the e-sports alive. But that raises other issues too.

Quote:
Every professional athlete who sacrifices schooling to train harder to reach their goal runs the risk of some extraneous circumstances preventing them.
Very true, however I think there is something more bitter about careers coming to an end due to a company board meeting where the directors decide to cease support, for example. SC2 progamers careers are at the mercy of the decisions of some businessmen who have no care for the players involved. Do the majority of progamers have the skill to switch to a totally different E-sport platform (e.g. FPS) should their career in SC2 no longer be an option?
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 1:11 PM BnetId: ToRErasmus.733  Race: Clan: ToR  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 1,454  # 5
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

How does blizzard not continuing support stop the game being played?

I don't really follow BW, but I understand there have been some patches in recent years, although I assume nothing groundbreaking, and that the game would still be played professionally even if blizzard hadn't released any patches since the game became reasonably mature.

If you're talking about issues such as the rights to broadcasting blizzard's IP which Kespa and OGN and stuff were all going to court about with regards to BW, it would be interesting to see the outcome if it wasn't Blizzard arguing that Party A was paying them royalties for the IP and party B wasn't, but Blizzard denying the livelihood of everyone involved in professional BW/SC2 by banning all the tournaments.

I don't really see how Blizzard's support is necessary once the game has received enough balance patches to iron out any huge issues. Please tell me how this is the case.
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 2:47 PM   Race: Location: Adelaide, Australia  Total Posts: 1,638  # 6
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aean(:
E-sports doesnt have much to offer compared to that of regular sports. Don't most starcraft progamers quit at the age of 25 or something due to not having as fast reflexes? 10-15hours a day practising a video game sitting down; regular sports provide long-term health benefits.
I'm not sure about reflexes but older people can still definitely have fast hands. Some of the best pianists in the world are 50+ years old.

Regular sports offer long-term health benefits... Until you tear a ligament, wreck a knee, get concussed or have a spinal injury!

PS. Stopped playing footy @ 23yo. Ligament tearing is baaad D:
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 3:09 PM BnetId: Makra.969  Race: Clan: HT  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 200  # 7
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

@Erasmus, as I said in the blog, without blizzard support the ladders would go to the pits. And without the ladders, SC2 would inevitably die. Unless you propose that tournaments and custom games would keep it alive, but I highly doubt so.
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 6:47 PM BnetId: Dox.792  Race: Location: Brisbane  Total Posts: 2,980  # 8
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aean(:
E-sports doesnt have much to offer compared to that of regular sports. Don't most starcraft progamers quit at the age of 25 or something due to not having as fast reflexes? 10-15hours a day practising a video game sitting down; regular sports provide long-term health benefits.
Historically, they've been quitting around that age because it hasn't been financially viable unless you were consistently taking podium wins. They decided it was time to invest in a career/family/etc. Modern eSports has revolutionised that image somewhat, so we may very well see an older generation of pro gamers emerge.
(We've already seen the likes of NesTea and Boxer doing well!)

Has nothing to do with reflexes mysteriously disappearing.
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 10:09 PM BnetId: ToRErasmus.733  Race: Clan: ToR  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 1,454  # 9
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Makra
@Erasmus, as I said in the blog, without blizzard support the ladders would go to the pits. And without the ladders, SC2 would inevitably die. Unless you propose that tournaments and custom games would keep it alive, but I highly doubt so.
You've heard of ICCUP right?

BW never had a ladder system built into the game, and it clearly did alright for itself.
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 11:10 PM BnetId: Arnor.836  Race: Clan: xGKing  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 1,967  # 10
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dox
Historically, they've been quitting around that age because it hasn't been financially viable unless you were consistently taking podium wins. They decided it was time to invest in a career/family/etc. Modern eSports has revolutionised that image somewhat, so we may very well see an older generation of pro gamers emerge.
(We've already seen the likes of NesTea and Boxer doing well!)

Has nothing to do with reflexes mysteriously disappearing.
You're forgetting White-Ra Who imo is a forerunner all aspiring non-Korean SCII players and the European version of Moonglade
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New Mon, 4th-Jul-2011, 11:51 PM BnetId: Makra.969  Race: Clan: HT  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 200  # 11
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Quote:
Originally Posted by |Erasmus|
You've heard of ICCUP right?

BW never had a ladder system built into the game, and it clearly did alright for itself.
Come on man, did you actually read the whole post? I addressed that. I may be wrong, but I was under the impression that due to how Blizzard designed Bnet 2.0, custom ladders such as ICCUP are not possible. Either that, or custom ladders are against Blizzard's Term's of Use.
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New Tue, 5th-Jul-2011, 8:40 AM BnetId: Arnor.836  Race: Clan: xGKing  Location: Sydney  Total Posts: 1,967  # 12
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Re: Careers: Sports vs E-Sports

Quote:
Originally Posted by Makra
Come on man, did you actually read the whole post? I addressed that. I may be wrong, but I was under the impression that due to how Blizzard designed Bnet 2.0, custom ladders such as ICCUP are not possible. Either that, or custom ladders are against Blizzard's Term's of Use.
people would manage, look at dota for instance, there's 2 decent clones of it now (LoL and HoN) and atleast 1/2 a dozen others which are good but never really made it big.

FPS theres the COD, CS and BFseries to look to, skills are interchangeable across games of the same genre

just look at rugby, plenty of good league players have made a decent career out of playing union
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