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FSBenAD · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:01 PM

Personally... From my point of view clan wars are like practice games.. In clan tournaments or tournaments with money on the line, I think stricter rules are good...

Anyway.

Must play as race ranked on SEA ladder
SEA account must be active (40 games a season ? Obvious exceptions for people who have gone away / moved house)
Go by current ladder rank or rank in last two season (whichever is higher)
Exception to all of the above granted by both captains in agreement...

My main objective is to get the games happening, to let people have fun. So if the opposition hve a guy who was masters two season ago, but was low masters and is clearly active and struggling in diamond or even plat now, I'd most likely allow them to play as a diamond

Edit: Obviously when doing an M/GM clan war, being active on SEA isnt as important...
Also we should be open about ranks on other servers, if someone is actively masters on another server, they shouldnt play in PD

**syfSoundwave** · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:03 PM

As I was saying in chatbox before, you don't lose that much skill not playing for a few months. If a player was Masters back in say, 2011-mid 2012 then sure, play them for a GPD clan war, but if a player was Masters within the last year or so I say they shouldn't be allowed to play GPD, because they're only 50 games or so away from getting their old skill back.

If they reached Masters by some fluke and despite repeated ladder attempts have been stuck in mid Diamondish, I'd say that's fine too.

EDIT: @ BenAD I actively encourage ETL's players to not play on SEA, so don't use SEA ladder as a basis for anything. Being open about their activity on other servers is good though, but relies a lot on trust.

**syfRize** · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:04 PM

Yes Ben I agree with the other servers rule 100%

Some very good feedback, will make a notepad file now!

Lokth · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:06 PM

Generally the only reason someone drops out of masters is inactivity; when the player actively plays they get back into masters relatively fast. If a player drops out of masters legitimacy playing and actively ladders for 2 seasons and still hasnt returned then sure that player is probably Diamond level. A player who goes away for a few months, finds himself demoted and plays a few games shouldn't be considered the demoted rank for at least a season after returning.

FLuX · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:08 PM

Assumedly, most clans have some kind of internal ranking system. If there's someone who is ranked

on ladder, but is consistently beating

level players in clan practice, then surely they shouldn't be allowed to play. At the end of the day, all friendly clan wars (yes, even

/

) should be treated as an exercise, a chance for players to play in a setting where they are playing for their team, and representing their team. Sure, it looks awesome when you have one player beat a bunch of players in the opposing team with ease, but it's better to have teams being evenly matched and seeing some closely fought and well played series.

**|Erasmus|** · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:08 PM

A player hitting masters and going 1-4 one season and 5-6 (going off the battle-net profile I can see for the player in question) the next given the current ladder policy where it is giving conservative placements and then promoting active players doesn't seem like a statistically large enough sample size for the ladder to know their rating.

The new system where a lot of people are put down a league on placement will cause more problems with these kinds of things than before. Because a lot of people can claim they were active and legitimately demoted, but for all we know are just 2 wins off being back in masters.

But there's no fair way to tell without discriminating against inactive players.

**syfSoundwave** · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:09 PM

We had a player who used to play SC2 actively named Halt. He was a very good player for us in GPD clan wars and he barely EVER laddered. I encouraged him to ladder and eventually, despite still being Diamond, was beating players like Lobo. I stopped letting him play GPD clan wars because his skill was clearly above GPD despite his league still allowing him to play.

What I'm saying is just be honest. Smurfing and having a Masters smash a bunch of Platinums and Diamonds accomplishes nothing. Clan wars are for fun and improving your own players of that league, which smurfing actively prevents.

ToRSpookToR · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:09 PM

honestly we should be going off NA ladder at this point

**syfRize** · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:10 PM

I gather that we can agree upon;
If there's a legitimate reason why they're not masters anymore they can be eligible, and no matter what rank they were in masters, a 10-12 month cap is placed down.
So if they were masters 9 months ago, they can't play.

We can also use NA as a guideline to the ranking history, that seems fair.
KR is all over the place though.
EU, well, not too many SEA players are active there.

FSBenAD · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ETL.Soundwave

As I was saying in chatbox before, you don't lose that much skill not playing for a few months. If a player was Masters back in say, 2011-mid 2012 then sure, play them for a GPD clan war, but if a player was Masters within the last year or so I say they shouldn't be allowed to play GPD, because they're only 50 games or so away from getting their old skill back.

If they reached Masters by some fluke and despite repeated ladder attempts have been stuck in mid Diamondish, I'd say that's fine too.

EDIT: @ BenAD I actively encourage ETL's players to not play on SEA, so don't use SEA ladder as a basis for anything. Being open about their activity on other servers is good though, but relies a lot on trust.

I think there is definitely a difference between someone who was masters 6 months ago and is just coming back and just got ranked in diamond, and someone who was masters 6 months ago and has played 100 games this season and is diamond.

I would let the latter player play, I wouldnt let the first (as you say it doesnt take long for the skill to come back if they were high/legit masters.)

Yeah I know alot of my players are going onto other servers.. and this is going to become a massive issue... I already think SEA gold is way harder then platinum used to be 6 months ago... Our players are playing more in other servers and yet we still base SEA ranks as the ranking for pretty much all clan wars...

I guess we can just do a blanket active league condition, but again as you say, we are relying totally on trust... But if you arent active on SEA, we already are relying on that...

ToRsupapower · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:11 PM

I think if you're a former masters player and now in diamond and have played 150+ games and haven't been promoted yet (which you most likely should be within 25-50 games if you're still at masters skill level) you should be allowed to play, doesn't matter how many season you're inactive for but if you can prove that after 150 or so games you are still at diamond then for sure go and play in a diamond tournament.

FLuX · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:13 PM

There's something innately flawed in the logic that ladder rank = skill level. If you want it to be fair, why not just make some kind of ELO system for every SEA player...

ToRSpookToR · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:14 PM

ill let you set that up

ToRsupapower · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcaspook

honestly we should be going off NA ladder at this point

I was under the impression this already happens? wow if it isn't.

Lokth · Mon, 24th-Jun-2013, 3:15 PM

There is a very big skill issue between Gold - Diamond on SEA which makes using SEA hard to judge. I mostly played NA last season (after getting Diamond very early on in sea); Got demoted to gold this season. At the moment I cant tell the difference in skill between the Diamonds im facing on NA verses the Golds and Plats im facing on SEA (The Diamonds on sea tend to feel around the same skill level as mid-high Diamonds).

If a ladder needs to be used for, NA is most likely more accurate