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Question : 6 pools >.<
 

I have question that has been bugging me since the beginning of time (1v1 SC2 time that is).

What are good followups to a 6 pool by a zerg in PvZ?

Ok before you say anything, there are a few scenarios :

Case 1
FFE : Small chokes e.g. Neo Planet S (or any map that can be walled off easily to protect natural)
This I consider generally fine because you can easily block it off.

Case 2
FFE : Wide impossible to wall chokes e.g. Akilon Wastes
So if I manage to get a cannon or 2 to protect my nexus... what to do next?
If I 1 base pressure into expand later, he might be prepared (if he isn't I win but that's rarely the case unless he's bad; then it either goes one sided after OR a long game with me feeling frustrated that I cant do as much)
Bearing in mind, he probs want to 1 base roaches into expand or expand into roaches, turtling, most probably getting mutas some time or banes to kill my poor probes etc etc

Case 3
Gate Expand : Why because he was random and turns out to be Zerg (How I hate when this happens)
Same as before if I counter, he might be prepared. I know it hurts his eco to make units but I cant break and again, it might turn out to be one sided OR a long game that frustrates me esp when I am likely to lose (base trade or no base trade). OR he might go banes and try to kill my poor probes.

Thanks.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

Case 2:
After you stabilize with your cannon in your mineral line, he'll be considerably behind in econ, go for a 2base timing.

Case 3:
4gate him after you hold the 6pool, you shouldn't take much damage since you went gateway expo.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

Case 2: Throw down gateway soon as you can after ONE cannon in mineral line. As soon as you have a zealot out you're safe from the initial 6 pool and you can just throw down a nexus. You should still have a probe out on the map, scout for a natural hatch (or pylon block it), and then you wanna scout if he has gas or not. Since he 6 pooled, the queen will be late and you can get in a see it.

If no gas, you're perfectly safe, if gas, he probs won't have expo, make units, if gas + expo, he's extremely behind on econ, just play safe. As long as you don't outright die to a 6p, any kind of econ follow up is a good thing, then into whatever you want really, but a strong 2 base timing is usually best (ie. immortal stalker sentry)

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

The best follow up after a failed 6 pool attack is to do another variation of 6 pool

First of all, you need 1.2k mineral for this to work.
Than built 6 pool in a manner like this -> xxx xxx
If all else fail, you can always start a new game.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

@cure and kez, thxs for the food for thought. The suggestion seems to lean more towards a 2 base timing push if I'm not mistaken.

Someone suggested a 2 sg voids followup. Any ideas how that followup compares with what has been suggested?

I guess I'm just scared because sometimes they use a lot of lings to attempt to contain or delay your expo. Having the moco helps these days but I still get nervous when I cant get my expo up smoothly.

@Theend... not quite sure what u mean. I think I missed something... how do u counter a 6 pool with a '6 pool' as toss? Guess I need some dark archons perhaps? Anyways, glad to hear from u, Theend

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

I'm interested in responses also

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

2sg voids pretty gas intensive and hits later then most other 2 base, this give the zerg more time to recover from the 6 pool.

Anyone know a good probe loss count that can be deemed "acceptable" (6 pool hits about 16-17 probes if they go straight for you).

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

no lemminks noob

nem let me 6 pool you over and over until we discover best way

dis gunna b goood..

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

Just kidding, lol
♪ lalala lalalala la ♫ ☺☻ ♪♫

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

Good question

omg! going to have '6 pool' nightmares...

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

2 Stargate is not an optimal opener. When you're ahead on economy in any game, you wan't a big brute force sledgehammer based army which has no "hard counter". The problem with tech based army's is they usually drop in effectiveness if the opponent has the right composition ie. Hydralisks. Secondly, 2 Stargate is bad as a lot of the time after a failed early pool they'll go into a speedling timing to deny your expo, and stargate (especially 2) isn't very good against it, as you won't have ample sentries to defend. 1 Stargate is probably ok however, as roaches CAN be a common follow-up, but even still, you should be able to see it coming and defend it aptly with cannons and sentries. Lastly, I understand it can be uncomfortable to take an expo after you get 6 pooled, but really you just have to throw it down and see what happens. When zerg see's you taking an expo straight after he 6 pooled you, it places a ridiculous amount of pressure on them. So my advice? throw it down after you get moco and zealot out, and then figure it out from there (building walls are your friend)

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

^ that. If you want to end the game on 2base, do it with a solid ground army.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

ok so it's something like moco + 1-2 zealots; try to get expo up; wall asap; forge(?); drop robo after expo (before walling? after wall?)

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

Zealot > stalker > sentry(s) (a lot depends on what you scout). WALL ASAP after you drop nexus, depending on what you want to go for, forge can be a part of your wall but doesn't have to be. Poke out with your zealot stalker to gauge how many drones/expos/gas, whilst keeping sentries at home. Robo after your wall is complete, and after nexus.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

I think I got a clearer picture of the followup. Thxs ^_^

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

People usually make 8-10 lings meaning you'll need 2 zealots to push into your natural.

I personally go core zealot zealot forge sentry nexus pylon at nat cannon 2 more gates. Hold position the 2 zealots on the ramp in case of speedling all ins and 1 base baneling etc, with a sentry behind them.

From there Stargate is the safest bet, I wouldn't really recommend 2base play in this scenario as he could be anything, like 2base muta.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

Just cauz you suck vs mutas pezz doesn't mean everybody does

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

another thing is, 2base timings don't actually work guys. I know everyone is recommending them, but i disagree.

Firstly, zerg isn't actually behind that much economically, they get an automatic forge + pylon at the natural and they drone up behind it real fast while denying a nexus for a good few minutes and getting a much earlier expansion of their own. Secondly, 2base timings will be so ridiculously unrefined that they just have very little chance of working. Thirdly, 2base tech is the most common followup for zerg. Meaning they will have a fast overseer to scout with, will identify your 2base timing and promptly throw down spines while getting their tech of choice. Good luck pushing through spines before muta or infestor or swarm hosts come out. And good luck defending muta with no blink or stargates or any tech of your own once they come out.

2 stargate might not actually be bad, it will beat muta transitions obviously and do well against anything else really.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

hmmm more food for thought...

When u mention Stargate, are you referring to 1 SG with nixes? or 2 SG with nixes? or voids?

Am really glad to hear from your experiences and advice... I believe many tosses will be interested to know more as well. ^_^

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

1sg phoenix is the safest way to play. 2sg with phoenix into voids could be good, but i haven't played it enough to know for sure. Key thing is that it shouldnt be all in though, it should be done with a third coming up behind it before gates etc.

Re: Question : 6 pools >.<
 

+2 blink allin is a good followup as an allin if u really wants to allin. Good vs mutas/roaches/everything else.

Normally if i get 6 pooled and i went FFE, i will make 2 zealots and chase the lings away and make nexus immediately, then i would wall my nat off with 1 forge and gates. Send 1 probe scout right after u chase the lings away and check for expo/gas. According to what the probe scouts, make 1-3 cannons to be safe against followup allins and chrono sentries if u suspect some roach allins or bane bust