[kikkoman]

Hi Sc2sea! (this is my first post). I attended ACL Melbourne which was my first LAN tournament. I had a great time it was such a good event but anyway, the point of my post:

I was watching RuineD's Mech play vs Protoss and I have to say I was very impressed. I know a lot of people consider mech to be very weak in TvP but the lack of Terrans playing mech means protoss is not very adept at playing against it. It could also be argued that there is still more to be explored with Mech with very few pro games ending with Terran acquiring their Endgame death army composition (BC/Ghost).

As a lower level Terran (Diamond) who is having a lot of difficulty playing Bio TvP I would love to see some of RuineD's replays or possibly talk to him about his play.

If you read this RuineD send me a PM if you like

Edit: This may be in the wrong forum (Meant to post in SC2 General)

[Stallion]

HuT is the mans replays i'd be after i hate his mech style. havn't really played ruined tho so mah

Quick Comments

	ROOTPetraeus:	wow bm
	ProAnnn:	YES I AGREE. Hut's mech is really irritating

[MezjE]

RuineD TvP was godly.

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by CombatEZ

RuineD TvP was godly.

who'd he beat?

[Fairyking]

I have trouble with it sometimes. Mainly mass cloak banshee thor raven T_T.

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by mGGZeratul

I have trouble with it sometimes. Mainly mass cloak banshee thor raven T_T.

thats an old style of tvp that i think was painuser came up with just need to think about how to react to it to beat that ^_^

[SanG]

Originally Posted by SQL.Stallion

thats an old style of tvp that i think was painuser came up with just need to think about how to react to it to beat that ^_^

Some korean unknown did. I think Jjakji was the first to showcase it in GSL

[fray`Alpha]

He beat (at least) me (masters) Champi (GM?) and ... cant remember his full name.. help me out if u know it.. xeno.. something... big blonde guy (diamond).

Thing with my games is that i had seen him going mech against the other 2 so knew it was coming and pretty much blind countered
and he still was able to 2-0 me..

I was really impressed with his games.. both against myself and champi.
and as the OP said i think mech is alright to use at this level cause not many protoss play it reguarly enough to be comfortable agianst it

Quick Comments

BearPack:

Xormentor

[SanG]

Originally Posted by Ali

He beat (at least) me (masters) Champi (GM?) and ... cant remember his full name.. help me out if u know it.. xeno.. something... big blonde guy (diamond).

Thing with my games is that i had seen him going mech against the other 2 so knew it was coming and pretty much blind countered
and he still was able to 2-0 me..

I was really impressed with his games.. both against myself and champi.
and as the OP said i think mech is alright to use at this level cause not many protoss play it reguarly enough to be comfortable agianst it

What's "mech" in this context? Thor helion? banshee thor marine? Tank helion?

[fray`Alpha]

Originally Posted by cRSanG

What's "mech" in this context? Thor helion? banshee thor marine? Tank helion?

he opened with a marine tank that kept me on the defensive for abit, then into hellion tank viking. while i went into air. he then mixed in thors and ghost.

the end game was basically him using BC Thor Ghost and tanks, not much a protoss can do against that.. at least in a straight up engagement. and he had turrent rings and PF around the place on metro (so narrow corridors) so was damn hard to get around him.

but yeah, marine tanke into tank hallion viking, turtling then mixing in ghost thors and BC

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by Ali

he opened with a marine tank that kept me on the defensive for abit, then into hellion tank viking. while i went into air. he then mixed in thors and ghost.

the end game was basically him using BC Thor Ghost and tanks, not much a protoss can do against that.. at least in a straight up engagement. and he had turrent rings and PF around the place on metro (so narrow corridors) so was damn hard to get around him.

but yeah, marine tanke into tank hallion viking, turtling then mixing in ghost thors and BC

thats the wierdest passive terran style i can think of seems to be a bit of everything will be interesting to play against

[kikkoman]

Originally Posted by cRSanG

What's "mech" in this context? Thor helion? banshee thor marine? Tank helion?

I will clarify what I mean by RuineD's mech from observing ~5 of his games.

His opens varied depending on map so I won't go into that too much. He opened hellion drop into expand or CC first into some rax to stay safe until he got tanks.

The mid game his composition was Hellion/tank with a huge siege line to secure 3 bases. At this time he added ghosts (I am not sure if that was reactive or if he does that every game.) When he was able to secure 4 bases he added 3 starports + a 2nd armory and a fusion core to start pumping out BCs and ship plating/ship weapons. At this time every spare 400 mineral was made into a CC and every time some supply was freed up from engagements he would slowly start adding more ghosts + BCs.

[SanG]

Originally Posted by kikkoman

I will clarify what I mean by RuineD's mech from observing ~5 of his games.

His opens varied depending on map so I won't go into that too much. He opened hellion drop into expand or CC first into some rax to stay safe until he got tanks.

The mid game his composition was Hellion/tank with a huge siege line to secure 3 bases. At this time he added ghosts (I am not sure if that was reactive or if he does that every game.) When he was able to secure 4 bases he added 3 starports + a 2nd armory and a fusion core to start pumping out BCs and ship plating/ship weapons. At this time every spare 400 mineral was made into a CC and every time some supply was freed up from engagements he would slowly start adding more ghosts + BCs.

EDIT: haven't read the 2nd page lol

[ProAnnn]

Thor Banshee raven is not really mech.. Just HT would counter it.

[fray`Alpha]

Yea should check out some of his games when the acl replays are released. he said his been doing it for a few months so it seems to be working for him. And I just didnt know how to beat it.

[BearPack]

I was talking to him about it, he was calling it "ghostmech", just a large mech force with 3 or so barracks constantly pumping out ghosts for EMPs/nukes, and then mixing in whatever he felt like in the late game.
Regardless, he is a ******* scary player.

[x5.RunaMoK]

i feel very happy when i helped him out with his t v p

im glad his wrecking people with it

[fray`Alpha]

Originally Posted by RunaMok

i feel very happy when i helped him out with his t v p

im glad his wrecking people with it

do you have his contact details (number and all that )

if u do can u PM it to kikko.. his just become a big fan and wants to see more :P

[x5.RunaMoK]

also could some1 email me the replays??


jdtmcmillan@hotmail.com

[x5.RunaMoK]

i'll ask ruined if he wants his details pm'd out.
you can normally find him in the ixlegion channel with us

[kikkoman]

Originally Posted by RunaMok

i'll ask ruined if he wants his details pm'd out.
you can normally find him in the ixlegion channel with us

Thanks! I'll check it out.

[RuineD]

Hey people, RunaMok sent me the link to the thread which is lucky because I probably would never have seen it. I was thinking of working on a Mech TvP guide in the future, and releasing some replay packs but right now im still working out the kinks etc, waiting to play some really good players just to see how they react etc.

I guess if you want to ask me questions you can add me on SEA, also I have a stream which I can link if you ever want to watch the games live or ask questions.
RuineD.430
stream - www.twitch.tv/ruinedsea

Quick Comments

nirvAnA:

welcome to sc2sea!!!!!!!!!

[MezjE]

Originally Posted by RuineD

Hey people, RunaMok sent me the link to the thread which is lucky because I probably would never have seen it. I was thinking of working on a Mech TvP guide in the future, and releasing some replay packs but right now im still working out the kinks etc, waiting to play some really good players just to see how they react etc.

I guess if you want to ask me questions you can add me on SEA, also I have a stream which I can link if you ever want to watch the games live or ask questions.
RuineD.430
stream - www.twitch.tv/ruinedsea

Glad you joined up and are already helping the community man! Hope you keep attending LANs

[SLCNPezz]

yo kikkoman! It was an interesting style and I talked with ruined a bit about it, he told me that it is very vulnerable to early timing attacks (pre-seige?) and that because of this you need to be DILIGENT with your scouting. This means either SCV scouting or scanning to see whether the toss made a natural, and then checking again at 6:30-7minutes for extra gateways.

[RuineD]

^this.

I don't really want to get into a discussion about it now because im fairly tired and not really thinking straight, and I could go on for a loooong time talking about all the specifics etc. I think its probs best if I release some kind of guide in the future or just answer questions online etc.
Runamok has helped me a lot trying to work out the most effective army comp so thanks to him for getting me into mech . He knows a fair bit about what to do etc, so i'm sure he'd be okay with answering some questiosn too?

Quick Comments

nirvAnA:

a guide would be cool! :)

[kikkoman]

Originally Posted by RuineD

^this.

I don't really want to get into a discussion about it now because im fairly tired and not really thinking straight, and I could go on for a loooong time talking about all the specifics etc. I think its probs best if I release some kind of guide in the future or just answer questions online etc.
Runamok has helped me a lot trying to work out the most effective army comp so thanks to him for getting me into mech . He knows a fair bit about what to do etc, so i'm sure he'd be okay with answering some questiosn too?

I'd love to see a guide on this in the future. But for now I'll start giving it a go and hit you up if I have any questions

[RuineD]

Im hoping to continue going to as many lans as I can, i'm regretting not meeting more people at ACL but i was pretty focused and kinda nervous so didn't really say hello to many T_T. hopefully ill see you guys in future events

Quick Comments

	calcifer19:	big bm troll :) ^^
	SLCNPezz:	hehe we had a nice chat >=3

[MezjE]

Originally Posted by RuineD

Im hoping to continue going to as many lans as I can, i'm regretting not meeting more people at ACL but i was pretty focused and kinda nervous so didn't really say hello to many T_T. hopefully ill see you guys in future events

Yeah you did well though man! Respawn you seemed nervous too playing on your laptop :P
We are all full of love dw.

[AxSGRiM]

RuineD raped me on ladder ,hes GoOd-y.

[inFeZa]

Ya know what beats mech?
Carriers

[fray`Alpha]

Originally Posted by inFeZa

Ya know what beats mech?
Carriers

i had 10 carriers with better upgardes -.- ghost and bc pretty good against carriers

[RuineD]

Originally Posted by inFeZa

Ya know what beats mech?
Carriers

carriers are terrible vs mech lol.

3/3 thor being repaired, as well as yamato/bc...

[ETL.ViTaL]

toss just needs to get hightemplar immortal archon--> in dealing with mech as long as they don't clump their ht then they can fight fairly reasonably against a mech terran (using feedbacks)

EDIT: could some one post replays of these games i'd be interested to see them

[RuineD]

its not "just needs to". When you play as mech or against mech you realise how efficient the mech army actually is, and it seems invincible. As long as ghosts are involved in the mech army then that high templar/immortal/archon cluster is going to get totally destroyed.

[HuT]

Ruineds mech looked pretty cool, but from what I saw he was turtling on tank ghost and getting a sick eco up, and Protoss' who are used to being the 'deathball' player gets owned since they have nfi how to react to it.

I think a good counter to his mech would be fast 3 base into air orientated play and focus on not losing probes to his harassment.

Quick Comments

mGGDrGooSe:

This is what protosses have been telling me also

[SLCNPezz]

Originally Posted by SQL.HuT

Ruineds mech looked pretty cool, but from what I saw he was turtling on tank ghost and getting a sick eco up, and Protoss' who are used to being the 'deathball' player gets owned since they have nfi how to react to it.

I think a good counter to his mech would be fast 3 base into air orientated play and focus on not losing probes to his harassment.

That is one way to play against mech, but you don't have to. On maps like entombed I would reccomend that since it's very easy to take a third in a choke. But on maps like shakuras or something, you can sit outside the natural and deny the mech player from ever taking a third. Force him to come down the ramp unseiged. If you deny the third of a meching player you take their fifth and sixth gas which ruined tells me is extremely important since you end up just floating minerals.

A good composition to be aggressive against mech is blink stalker collosus with a few immortals chucked in, zealots may seem like a nice idea but in reality get melted to the hellions which will now be serving 2 purposes: buffering for the mech army and dealing with the zealots.

Blinking on top of tanks while their seiging can also be incredibly powerful...

[RuineD]

Hut is correct, but the good thing about mech is that you have the ability to be aggressive if the toss is being super greedy. There are little timings you have if protoss decide to skip a certain tech path or go very little unit instead focusing on eco or tech to respond to mech. for example, fast 3rds and 4ths can be punished, or matched with a super fast expo of your own. The reason i am very passive as mech is because it is extremely risky to be out on the map unless you know you are in a position to do so. once the mech army dies its extremely hard to remax again, and warpin means that after a battle which you might believe you have easily won its actually much closer and can result in all your units being killed.

[asdfSchnitzel]

Dragon has also been playing around with mech tvp a bit

[ETL.ViTaL]

Its funny how seriously people are taking mech as a possibility in the TvP matchup since its success with a few players as like a week a go there was another thread suggesting how bad mech is in TvP and how it can't work- Its good I like the innovation

[RuineD]

Well since im maintaining a 70-80% ratio TvP (past about the 10 minute mark) on ladder going mech it seems to me it is pretty damn viable.

[DUCKVILLELOL]

Ruined despite being a Protoss player I'm actually a huge fan of Mech in TvP (I originally played Terran during beta trying to mech everything but I couldn't get it to work because I'm a bad...) - I saw a bit of the playstyle and it seems similar but different to the way LastShadow has been doing mech TvP, he'll normally aim to get a good amount of thors out before the BC switch, any thoughts on that? From a replay I have from one of your games you didn't bother with them.

Speaking of which, I'll be doing a cast of one of your games, and if you have any other long-term TvP mech games that you think are worth casting please let me know, I rarely ever get to cast it!

[|Erasmus|]

any replays, please?

Theorising is good, but can't really learn how to play it off just a bit of discussion...

[RuineD]

I am going to put a replay pack together of all my mech games in the future, probably get around to it tomorrow and I can submit it on the site.

And to duckville, lastshadow's style is much more aimed at doing a timing attack, whereas the way I play is to try play long macro games. Thors are pretty good, but it gets to a point where toss can overrun them fairly easily. Its all up to preference - personally I believe players like Jinro play mech wrong - often times he is very aggressive and it is this aggression which ends up being his downfall.

But yeah I'll submit some replays tomorrow.

Quick Comments

VB_heathen:

this rookie terran looks forward to seeing these replays

[DUCKVILLELOL]

Originally Posted by RuineD

I am going to put a replay pack together of all my mech games in the future, probably get around to it tomorrow and I can submit it on the site.

And to duckville, lastshadow's style is much more aimed at doing a timing attack, whereas the way I play is to try play long macro games. Thors are pretty good, but it gets to a point where toss can overrun them fairly easily. Its all up to preference - personally I believe players like Jinro play mech wrong - often times he is very aggressive and it is this aggression which ends up being his downfall.

But yeah I'll submit some replays tomorrow.

Yeah fair enough. I sometimes use his style when I want to attempt some Terran, got me a couple of wins in lower leagues hehe.

Thanks for sharing, I'll probably cast one or two later once you have some reps up.

[Shieldz]

his mech play is pretty sick and hard to beat

[Dox]

I have all of his replays, I'll try to get them up by the end of the day.

[RuineD]

thanks Dox, i'll chuck them in with my own replay pack as well once they have been uploaded

[VB_Rhuubarb]

OMG! Finally someone to look up to