[breadfan]

Originally Posted by ToREchoes

1 build per match up, depth over breadth imo.

While I whole heartedly agree, my concern is forcing something harrass-ey on a large map like TDA. Say you want to hit a protoss right as warp gate is about to finish - potentially, you leave your base, warp gate finishes and he spots your incoming units, does a round of warp ins and then when you are knocking on his front door, he is able to get a second round of warp ins off. Proxies might be good here but I think Trusty had a good point, and I think this type of play is more suited to a competition match.

So I guess the question is now, when do I expand from this style of build focus? Diamond? Masters? GM?

[Trusty]

Originally Posted by breadfan

While I whole heartedly agree, my concern is forcing something harrass-ey on a large map like TDA. Say you want to hit a protoss right as warp gate is about to finish - potentially, you leave your base, warp gate finishes and he spots your incoming units, does a round of warp ins and then when you are knocking on his front door, he is able to get a second round of warp ins off. Proxies might be good here but I think Trusty had a good point, and I think this type of play is more suited to a competition match.

You should do your builds on all maps, unless you already have a firm understanding of what limitations each map presents to your build.

I would still recommend doing it anyway....

Edit:
What you're trying to do is improve your execution & multi tasking skills. In reality you should not care at all what league/rank you are (I don't).
Most of last season I was intentionally doing builds that were weak to certain maps, because they were multi-tasking builds.

Like Collosus WP harass in PvT on all maps, even if there was very little 'dead space' around the base to harass from.

You end goal is to become a player that has the skills required to execute any build easily. It's also why it's generally considered that Terran is the race that will make you a 'better player' the fastest, as they have the easiest access to multi-tasking scenarios (read: medivacs)

[Stallion]

Originally Posted by Trusty

You should do your builds on all maps, unless you already have a firm understanding of what limitations each map presents to your build.

I would still recommend doing it anyway....

this is true you should have a generic build that works on all maps and then add things in as you get better per map

[Jaywalk]

Originally Posted by breadfan

While I whole heartedly agree, my concern is forcing something harrass-ey on a large map like TDA. Say you want to hit a protoss right as warp gate is about to finish - potentially, you leave your base, warp gate finishes and he spots your incoming units, does a round of warp ins and then when you are knocking on his front door, he is able to get a second round of warp ins off. Proxies might be good here but I think Trusty had a good point, and I think this type of play is more suited to a competition match.

So I guess the question is now, when do I expand from this style of build focus? Diamond? Masters? GM?

if your doing safe solid macro builds, you shouldn't need to hit at any pre conceived timing, but react to what he is doing and find the timings as the game progresses you can also tweak your core builds on the fly to be more reactive.

[Trusty]

Originally Posted by breadfan

So I guess the question is now, when do I expand from this style of build focus? Diamond? Masters? GM?

Never, keep doing it.

See a cool thread on TL that has a build you want to try? Chuck it in one of your match ups, spam it.
See someone do a sick timing in GSTL? Watch the vod. Break the build down on paper. Use it, spam it.

Literally, your goal should be that if you loaded a replay of you, and one of MVP - there should be no difference till the 'deviation' parts in the build. Him doing a 2rax should be the same as you doing a 2rax (obviously his micro will be better :P).

That's your goal, hit all the benchmarks. Don't be late on any of your stuff.


Here's a cute example I like to say to my students (I use PvP as an example).
There are 2 guys, A & B. Both play protoss.
- Player A only practices 4gate. He can do it perfectly, hitting a 5:34 warp-in every time. Regardless.
- Player B 'just does' a variety of builds. He doesn't care about hitting perfect benchmarks. He does a variety of 1gate tech 'stuff', and just puts it down to 'build order loss' when he loses to 4gate.

For examples sake, Player B cannot get a sentry out vs suspected 4gate by 5:25 when he's doing 1gate Robo/Stargate/TC - he hasn't practiced and refined his builds enough.

They meet in a tournament, best of 5.
What do you think is going to happen if player A decides to 4gate 3 games in a row?

He's going to Dominate player B.
- Player B has no idea on the exact time he needs to scout in order to afford a Sentry by 5:25.
- He doesn't know the exact time he needs to add his 2nd and 3rd gateway.
- He doesn't know how to position his units on a secondary-ramp like Shakuras nat.
- He doesn't know to use 3 cb's on WG, and save a 4th at the 'danger time' (5:10 -> 5:35).
- He is only able to warp-in one panic-sentry, then falls over and dies.

Practice makes perfect. Don't cut corners in your practice. If you can't hit similar timings as Nestea/Mc/Mvp, then keep practicing till you can.
Don't make excuses.
Don't compare yourself to your friends/peers around you on the ladder.

Someone bitches to you when you 4gate them? Calls you a noob? Tells you "You'll get nowhere doing that, noob"??
You just tell them: "Where do you think you'll go if you keep losing to it?".

Final note: Don't plateau. If you think you've mastered a build, start a new one. Keep learning.

Quick Comments

	breadfan:	Wow, that edit turned this into a real gold mine. You have been amazingly helpful this thread
	FlashVeno:	amazingly true
	FSBenAD:	Great post!
	rezyn8:
	Nemo:	Thanks, very interesting.
	SLCN.Kez:	Motivational!
	illpot: