[syfPhoenix]

ok replay analysis time for all u great zerg players :P
basically i can beat masters level terran and high diamond zerg but i cant beat the low plat toss's and this caused me to drop to plat just b4 season close and guess wat match up i only ever get
anyways.. i just want ana analysis of this game im pretty sure i lost due to micro but i want you to tell me

[syfPhoenix]

oh apparently my replay didnt upload umm some1 wanna tell em how cause i just tried to attach it as a file

[Daboo]

On hte bottom right, there's a section called replays...click on it and find the upload button...

Quick Comments

syfPhoenix:

[syfPhoenix]

http://www.sc2sea.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=523 theres the linkage

[inFeZa]

http://drop.sc/45877 This is what i like to do PvZ These days. Early mothership's !!

Quick Comments

Next_rim:

I approve of this tactix

[Satu]

I think you could have made some spines, they are more cost efficient than additional roaches and also are good at stacking more dps on top of your roaches. You probably dont have to make spines everywhere, just enough spines to delay his push a bit to allow more roaches to be produced.

You engaged when you didnt have enough roaches, so some way of buying additional time like spines could have helped.

Also, not too sure about your 15g15p opening, delays your hatchery too much.

[syfPhoenix]

well i never got taught or learnt and zvp openings cause i have always been good at marco mainly and focused on my zvt machup
thanks for the advice (more spines), i also messed up my opening in that match i think

[PiG]

I'll give you some advice Dimaga gave me after Hasuobs destroyed me at IEM.

"Zerg units not good. You need use them or they shit. " - Dimaga

Basically. Attack, attack alot. And don't be afraid of FF. This doesn't mean you need to attack the entire game. But it means you want to build your economy to a certain point while scouting your opponent. And identify a good time to produce pure units for a few rounds and go attack. For instance as they take their 3rd.

A good example of where i got my units and went and killed my opponent was me vs light in the ACL showmatch from the other night (go to about 10:00 for the shattered temple game):

http://www.twitch.tv/aclpro/b/297757961


He took a fast 3rd and teched collosuss at the same time so I decided to kill him. Because this map is retarded to attack into the natural or 3rd, I upgraded drops and with deceptively low multitasking proceeded to attack 3 or so points repeatedly. Protoss units suck when they are split up and so i could trade efficiently this way and just had to keep up injects at home and barely micro my stuff.

Drops or just regular multipronged attacks pwn protoss and if you lose some stuff to FF it usually doesnt really matter cos zerg units are cheap.

Zergs i coach tend to die to protoss cos they are too afraid of sentries to engage even if the sentries have relatively low dps with them and so it would be a good time to hit and make them use energy inefficiently. Also they stop injecting the moment they go aggressive and build up a massive bank. Keep expanding alot vs protoss even if you don't saturate the bases and keep injecting all game. Don't freeze up in forcefield-fear.

Always remember each forcefield used is like killing a zealot, as long as you keep up the pressure and don't let them regenerate. (someones going to say 'ACTUALLY ITS NOT LIKE THAT', i don't care about your unit resource cost analysis, its a good way to think about it).

Quick Comments

	Eldrid:
	TADivinity:	ACTUALLY ITS NOT LIKE THAT. I like drops.

[xGKingdelete]

i don't play zerg, but i lose to zerg very frequently.

i think you lost because you were kind of playing blindly. after he pushed away your first 4 initial zerglings, the only time you scouted him again was with the suicidal overlord. the next time you saw anything was when the stalker-sentry-immortal deathball pushed out. from your point of view, you aren't even sure if he has an expansion up.

so try to constantly poke around the front of his base with zerglings and see his army composition, and any tech he puts at the front (such as the extra gateways, which indicated that he wasn't rushing straight for collosus). you can use this information to get the appropriate counter to what you see (maybe you could have got out a few infestors)


never fight a battle that you are going to lose, even if it's at your base. his army was too strong for you to engage head-on, so you should have delayed as long as possible for more roaches to spawn, or pulled drones for the battle. They can tank a lot of the stalker/immortal fire.

also, perhaps most important thing is the way you engage into a battle. you want as many units attacking as possible. even if you're ahead by 30 supply, with 2-1 against 1-0 upgrades, you'll still lose the battle if half of your army is stuck behind forcefields. against a deathball, you have to make some kind of concave or surround so all of your units are attacking (sentries can only forcefield so much).
so in the engagement at your ramp, if you split your roaches, taking half of them to the left of the ramp and the other half to the right, you would have had nearly all of your roaches attacking, and with reinforcements you would have crushed it.

[syfPhoenix]

thanks for all the feedback guys
also im often afraid to scout with my roachs as they are very slow off creep and even with speed their rlly slow so i oftne play blind should i mix in some zerglings?

Quick Comments

PiG:

Definitely mix in some lings purely for scouting yep :)

[SLCN.Kez]

mix in some zerglings yeah or just get an overseer! at 50/50 these days u should _ALWAYS_ morph one as soon as you hit lair (around 7:30-9 mins depending) to see exactly what is going on, but if for some reason u dont have lair i like to sac a ling into the front to see his army composition and go from there. I didnt watch your game, but yeah a lot of zergs (and myself) either dont engage in a part of the map where they can trade efficiently enough, or they engage at the front of their base where they cant remax in time before the toss kills enough shit that it doesnt matter in the first place. For a long time I had a lot of trouble with toss because of this, Until recently when i started going muta/ling off 3 bases (4 hatches) and pressuring their 3rd a shit ton! Split up your lings and mutas to 2 hotkeys, and simply fly ur mutas in 1 area of the his base(s) and then when he rotates his army send ur lings into his nat or where hes trying to take his 3rd and then he either (loses his 3rd, loses a shit ton of his army, or loses a lot of his probes/buildings in his main)
Dont always be so focused on killing workers either, sometimes it can be better to kill a few pylons/robo/support bay or something as this will delay his push a tonne, and forces him to spend more gas n stuff.
So yeah basically another version of what pig said hehe.
If you do go muta ling tho be careful not getting caught in it for to long, as eventually he will be able to move out (even on 2 bases) and usually have a big enough force to beat you in a straight up battle, but yeah its a great strategy i find Good luck vs protoss!!

[zeffrin]

I play protoss... I always feel bad for oppoonent when I get matched with Zerg

tbh the most effective thing zerg can do is as they said... a couple of spines to hold off my first few units... get your hatches up and some economy going and as soon as I'm going for a tech you just push with a tonne of roaches... keep bringing in more zerglings all through the attack...

The roaches easily take all the zealots... induce forcefields and start damaging stalkers... once the zealots are gone and sentry energy used up your lings with roach support just roll over whatever's left.

If I did manage to get immortals out make sure you handle that quickly, try keep your roaches where it's firing split if you can micro it, the lings will sort the immortal out pretty quick.

If I somehow manage to get storm, collusus or void rays just go back home and make hydras and/or infestors... then go win.

Also what PiG said is absolutely correct... hard to stop you just making hatches everywhere because split up my units are basically useless...

If they get DT to prevent you expanding etc, as soon as you know I've warped in a few and therefore used all my gas... for the cost of a couple of overlords (don't let my stalkers get to them) you can just go end the game with the roaches.

And there it is, maybe this is just my weakness to Zerg but I can beat any build except when they just make a shit tonne of roaches and come kill me while Im getting my second going/teching