[nirvAnA]

You can find everything related to the drama here as well as del's original personal attack in response to his infraction.

Summary:

1. del leaves a negative comment about the race wars without reading properly that line ups weren't out yet
2. I infracted him for it as it was his fault to be so quick to make such a comment without reading
3. del makes 400 word personal attack. Hes missing the point, his infraction was about not reading the thread and its the same way people on TL are warned for not reading the OPs and making stupid comments. He follows up with negative attack on the whole of the sc2sea community, mods and my wife.
4. Gets banned for 1 week for that response. The mod team and people who read it suggest it was way too lenient and him to be banned for longer.
5. I realise in his anger he also went on to cancel the BSGCL, and furthermore delete the OP which had all information to ensure no one else would be able to continue it.
6. Ban is extended indefinitely, losses trust and is removed as Team Au Manager
7. Comments from dels friends spill over to NW2 thread and everything is moved here so threads don't get derailed

---

"my comment about putting down tournaments not organised by him"
It didn't manifest out of thin air, and i remember how discouraging it was for me as I experienced this first hand. When I first started organising stuff on TL or first created sc2sea when we were nothing - one of the first few comments would always be by del and be something negative / sarcastic. Then I realised he did this for any every other organiser in SEA as well. Some examples

sc2sea.com's weekly KOTH - http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/view...opic_id=154412
del "so will this be like a one-day only SEA event cos we will all go to the US server?"

Ichors tournament - http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/view...opic_id=199391
del "Still has to be better than $20 first prize even if it's $20,000 of mousepads."

When sc2sea first started out - http://www.sc2sea.com/showthread.php?p=13683#post13683
del "I think we should maybe aim a bit lower, and at least get SC2SEA to a level where it's mediocre first. "

There are countless other examples this was just a quick 5 minute search.

Do I think he really wants to help the community? Does he ever make such comments when hes part of the event? I.e Nation Wars. Does he view us as a threat? He loves being in charge and when someone else comes along his position feels threatened. Hence my comment about him always putting down other organisers. This is a side of del that his friends would not have experienced. He goes out of his way to put down tournaments, and does not have a good relationship with other organisers because of this. del-benji, del-dox, del-nirvana. In many cases, to validate his point he has made use of the support of his friends against them TA vs Benji, FXO vs DoX, TA vs nirvana.

If he truly cared about the community he would never have left such remarks, and would have helped encourage or support organisers or give them the means to be able to reach out to the community. For e.g the BSGs, GPDs, and now even the BSGCL were not any of my ideas, people approached me with them by PM and I took the time to encouraged them to go with it, helped them with the rules/format/templates, ran them through the organising process and provided them the structure to run it to reach out to the community.

Now compare my actions with dels and you will see a huge difference in the way we do things and grow communities. If TA did not have a BSG team, do you honestly think del would have even created a BSG league in the first place? Im not saying he created it solely for TA but when he does "community" stuff its always aligned with his own interests. TA wasn't doing so hot in BSGCL and FXO was giving him pressure and hence my comment about making events when its aligned to his own interests. Rossi he didn't just get a gentle reminder, he got yelled it for spending so much time on NON-FXO stuff just before I infracted him (which i did not know until later of course).

Do I feel he has contributed to sc2sea? My relationship with him has always been shaky, but I always did my best to keep it neutral (and believe me that was a massive challenge). Because the events he holds even though aligned to his own interests does benefit the AU SC2 community and so for the greater good I've put aside our personal differences, even despite of my Mod team telling me to ban him repeatedly since the site first begun. Recall

del "I think we should maybe aim a bit lower, and at least get SC2SEA to a level where it's mediocre first. "

He was basically always putting us down in multiple threads right from the start at the crucial point where we really needed support. And only when we started becoming big and successful did he start being positive because he wanted to be part of the influence and exposure we were getting. The people who have helped built this community are the ones who really give their time or their money, from the donators to the organisers who take their time to run stuff or normal members who take the time to make constructive posts and help others with their strategy. Playing in tournaments and winning prizes does not contribute to building the community. Yes, some of TA have played a big part and if I had to identify people from TA who have helped the most it would probably be Pinder/EdgE to a certain extent for good posts, Fourby a regular donator (who recently joined TA), Paroxysm who organised many events and most recently Edarus who is helping organise the BSGCL.

---

"freedom of speech"

If there wasn't any this thread wouldn't exist.

basically its brought up continuously by del/deth their friends. I call them "friends" and not "TA" because i have nothing against TA nor do i hold any grudges because they belong to TA. Most of TA are perfectly fine people and if they post something negative I attribute it to be because they are supporting their friends out of friendship and that is what good friends do. Why is this so? Because in over 30,000 posts there have been no other people who were not from TA who have had any problems whatsoever with the way sc2sea is run. If you remove del/deth related posts there would be 0 posts with people who have a problem.

This also ties in with the freedom of speech / expression argument. Apart from del/deth/zanoku/uncletom/Mancannon I have never had to delete anyones posts. When faced with the predicament of "preserving someones freedom of speech" or "deleting the thread for the good of the community" the later we be chosen every single time and its not close at all.

1. I don't want people to open threads and see it derailed with battles of personal opinions/ "freedom of speech".
Case in point - KPoP thread. An exciting thread with potential for meetups with the community turned into an immature battle of musical preference.

2. I dont want people to be offended by racist / sexual remarks and then "decide for themselves if they are offended by it"
Case in point - ManCannon's constant sexual remarks about kelly

3. I dont want the reputation system to be abused, however vulnerable it may inherently be.
Tagging certain people actually proved to be amazing deterrent to stop the abuse even though i copped so much shit at the start for implementing it. The reputation system is now used so much better as evidenced in this thread. See this thread http://www.sc2sea.com/showthread.php?t=2011

That thread is a perfect example of how people can express opinions but still keep it civil, and it becomes a good read. It never derails into immaturity or personal attacks and this is the way "difference of opinions" should be communicated. These are in my opinion what makes forms good, a pleasant environment people can enjoy which produces good feelings rather than a troll filled preservation of everyone's opinion. Other sites who dont have harsh moderation CG, BA etc will suffer, sc2sea will not. TL will not. There are ways to bring across the same message rather than being so overtly negative.

[deL]

Meh pretty boring lineups after all prob won't watch.

Quick Comments

	Paroxysm:	C'mon man, 1 year anniversary! Definitely worth the watch!
	nirvAnA:	lol lineups are not even out, nice try again to put down any event not orgnaised by you. grow up man

[nirvAnA]

lol @ del trying to put down any event he is not a part off. This is a fun event I'm taking the time to organise for the community. Stop viewing us a threat, we aren't going to take away your "importance" or the tournaments you organise.

Update: benji, tgun, iaguz, Azz, edge and soulmanfou have accepted their invites.

More players will be added to the confirmed list as the replies come in, the list so far was just whoever was on at 2am last night.

[deL]

Originally Posted by nirvAnA

lol @ del trying to put down any event not organised by him. Stop viewing us a threat, we aren't going to take away your "importance" or the tournaments you organise.

I don't organise any tournaments on SEA... I thought those were final lineups seeing you didn't list other invites anywhere and stated my opinion on the lineup.

Sorry for having an opinion. ******* sick of this bullshit, I'll be sure to suck your tiny asian dick every time you so much as fart on this site next time. SC2SEA seems more like one big wank for you to rip off team liquid and feel like you're doing something for the community, and for the few moronic admins to feel like they are a TL admin.

Just because you put a half-arsed 1.5 hours of effort in to someone else's idea doesn't entitle you to praise. Yes we realise it's out of your pocket and yes we realise sc2sea is useful for SEA coverage, but you already compensate that with your constant putting aLt on a pedestal, denying anyone an opinion, shoving coaching down our throats, or flogging your grandmaster manual piece of shit to victims who don't know any better. You can have a successful community without cupping each others balls over every ******* piece of shit you churn out, and having people around to challenge your ideas with view to improve them is a positive thing.

You always use maturity and stubbornness as an argument against me correcting you or any TA member doing anything but you should take a look in the ******* mirror. The other day I asked quite innocently about whether there would be a 2nd season of SEACL or SEASL and you said Mr Ray lost interest. You said it'd because of all the childish comments (read: legitimate questioning of faulty rules) and I joked that it was dodgy administrating (not really true but at least you should have had the balls to not let shit like disallowing a big part of the SEA community fly). If I did the same it would be an instant ban and berating of me to your mates, but did all of TA come on and stir shit afterwards? No. Did I hold a grudge and pidgeonhole your entire personality off one event? No. You live in your own world where everyone who disagrees is conducting a direct personal attack on you and if you weren't so insecure you would realise it's not the case.

The person I most feel sorry for is your wife.

[nirvAnA]

So del admitted he left that comment because he thought it was the final lineup. I infracted him because he clearly did not read the OP and was so quick to say something negative about it. Anyway, once he realised it was not the final lineup instead of retracting his comment he decided to leave a 400 word essay about how opinions are not allowed (notice how sAint's comment is perfectly acceptable because he DID read the OP) and the whole sc2sea community is a worthless TL rip off and admins are moronic TL moderator wannabes (i'm sure DoX, BakaInu and Eddie would love to hear that) Oh and also to get extra personal he added something about being sorry for my wife. del was banned for 2 weeks for his actions on both his accounts.

This thread is about the racewars and one year anniversary celebrations. People are free to express their opinions about the lineups and talk about it but any derailment will be removed from this thread. The whole point of this was to have a celebration event for 1 year of the sc2sea community. Imagine what it would be like if sc2sea.com never existed, there would be no tournaments like COs, SEASL, SEACL, BSGS, GPD or even a place for our community to gather, find clans, find partners etc. Neither will there be easy tournament information and organisation since all SEA news get buried so fast on TL due to in being so popular with bigger events.

Moderators/admins dedicate countless hours of their own time to manage and run things, and to keep a delicate balance between whats being allowed and what isn't so we don't end up like sites tolerated trolling/immaturity and have become unpleasant and have died off. del has managed to abuse / discredit the site, the moderators and somehow my wife too all in one paragraph. He has been already temp banned three times in the past and not by me, by bakainu - for basically making the unpleasant environment we want to avoid.

But for every del there are a thousand people who appreciate and love the community we have formed over here. I wish to celebrate this awesome SEA community that has developed over this 1 year and do not want this thread to be turned into some E-Drama (dox/major) that will overshadow our 1 year birthday. Please stick on topic and enjoy the Race Wars!

[nirvAnA]

Update: Jaczie is the confirmed caster for the Singapore vs Taiwan games this week!
Her co-caster will probably be Paz(to be confimed)

http://www.twitch.tv/jaczie

Also, as some of you may know after dels sudden withdrawal from the BSGCL I cannot trust him to perform his duties and he will be relieved of his position of Team Australia's Manager.

Long story short is yesterday I infracted him for making a negative comment about the racewar lineups because he did not bother to read the post properly and the full lineups we not up. (note: I did not infract saint/sensei who also made a negative comment, because he DID read.) Unhappy with the infraction he went on to make a 400word rant making a huge personal attack on sc2sea, the mods on the site and somehow my poor wife ended up getting some too. So I temp banned him for that rant and in "retaliation" he instantly abandoned the BSGCL with the reason being "blame nirvana", even going as far to delete the OP which contained all the vital information for the BSG teams (this was restored).

Due to this, I cannot trust him to perform his duties should something similar occur and we have decided to relieve him from his duty as Team Australia manager for Nation Wars. To maintain good management of the Australian team, which is one of the current favorites to win this event, Dox will replace del as the Team Australian manager to provide good scheduling and management for the team and ensure they perform their best until the end of Nation Wars.

I have spoken to jump and DoX already to confirm this and from this moment on DoX will be replacing deL as Team Australia's Manager in the Nation Wars.

All team selections and player lineups against China will remain exactly the same. DoX will be helping coordinate and arrange the times with his players for the match vs China, and if Australia reaches the finals he will be submitting the 5 chosen players in the finals. The Australian Team selection will stay intact for the rest of the season.

-nirvana

[NvRossi]

thats retarded

Quick Comments

	[TA]LoSt:	it's definitely well spun
	cRSenSei:

[mGMUSE]

everyone needs to chill

im not siding with either side as i feel that there is more to the story than nirvana's version(from nirvana's pov it obviously seems like del was being a prick)

however despite what stupid actions del did to the bsgcl, i dont think del should be removed as team aus manager. sc2sea and the nation wars are different things and should be treated separately. besides as people above have stated he's an excellent manager. if anything just put dox as assistant manager.

im not siding with either side as i feel that there is more to the story than nirvana's version

Quick Comments

	NvRossi:	respect!
	cRSenSei:	/agreed
	TAScarecrow:
	Champi:

[JacziE]

Muse you have a point, but admittedly, even having a little preference over the TA boys at times, deL was quite out of line in his reply vs. nirvana that I flinched reading it, especially from someone I consider a good friend.

Quick Comments

cRSenSei:

no preference over the TA boys, they have just had the results lately compared to others

[JacziE]

When was my point about results? (:

[TAScarecrow]

Originally Posted by nirvAnA

Also, as some of you may know after dels sudden withdrawal from the BSGCL I cannot trust him to perform his duties and he will be relieved of his position of Team Australia's Manager.

Due to this, I cannot trust him to perform his duties should something similar occur and we have decided to relieve him from his duty as Team Australia manager for Nation Wars. To maintain good management of the Australian team, which is one of the current favorites to win this event, Dox will replace del as the Team Australian manager to provide good scheduling and management for the team and ensure they perform their best until the end of Nation Wars.

To be honest, this looks like a cheap shot at deL. He has done so much for Australian starcraft and he'd hardly jeopardize it over some stupid vendetta. It's not a matter of trust. If he sabotages Team Aus he'd lose the respect of the community he truly cares about. Besides what damage can he even do as team manager? Furthermore since when does Nirvana decide who manages the Australian team?

If you'd left up deL's post it would give this alot more credibility. I find it hard to believe it's as black and white as the official story.

[nirvAnA]

I agree he has done alot for the AU community when it was aligned with his own interests. He already lost all the trust from the community by suddenly abandoning the BSGCL in anger. Remember that was his tournament and decision to run it on the site and something totally unrelated to his infraction. It was this action that made me lose all my trust in him and I don't wish to even risk something similar happening to the Australian team which have a very strong chance of winning the Nation Wars.

Had to delete his post as I didnt wish to turn the Race War thread into an argument of free speech yet again vs dels buddies. Its supposed to be a fun tournament and celebration but its already tainted by del in the very first post as you can see. Many of the mods can still see the post and everyone agrees del was way out of line, it was a full blown personal attack in response to an infraction. I received multiple pms on bnet that day as well from regular sc2sea members who read his rant and were disgusted by dels post and his sudden cancellation of the BSGCL in retaliation. I initially temp banned him for 7 days but at their urging increased it to something harsher.

Also something relevant that paints the "whole story" better is he was specifically reprimanded by FXO management for focusing on non-FXO stuff just before I gave him the infraction, which was the catalyst that caused him to blow up and the real reason he had to cancel the BSGCL. The real "cheap shot" was him trying to pin the cancellation of it on me, when he could have stated the real reason and arranged for admins to help take over.

Anyway don't wish to derail this thread further, its about the Nation Wars 2 Semi Finals. You can msg me on MSN scarecrow.

[NvRossi]

No offense nirvana but just posting this even though i dont agree with the way del acted, there is more then your side to this story:

"I agree he has done alot for the AU community when it was aligned with his own interests."

-
I am disgusted you can say that and anybody who truly believes that is kidding themselves.

"Also something relevant that paints the "whole story" better is he was specifically reprimanded by FXO management for focusing on non-FXO stuff just before I gave him the infraction, which was the catalyst that caused him to blow up and the real reason he had to cancel the BSGCL. The real "cheap shot" was him trying to pin the cancellation of it on me, when he could have stated the real reason and arranged for admins to help take over."

Completely misinformed - He's allowed to pursue his own interests in SC2 or tournaments as long as it doesn't compete directly with FXO or infringe on his time spent doing FXO-related duties as far as i know from his TA contributions.

It was the last straw when Nirvana posted this below. I can see how nothings changed.

"lol @ del trying to put down any event he is not a part off. This is a fun event I'm taking the time to organise for the community. Stop viewing us a threat, we aren't going to take away your "importance" or the tournaments you organise."

You may think he acted wrongly and i definitly agree but it was purely emotional frustration resulting in a spur of the moment response which probably shouldnt have been made.

Fabricating more personal attacks which display del in a negative light, i believe is just as childish as what del posted in the first place and the fact you have had time to think about it makes it a little cowardly.

Del hasn't talked much about sc2sea except that he meant to leave it for good due to feeling unappreciated for what effort he and the rest of TA did put in to making sc2sea a good site for SEA players. Thanks only to some immature trolling and personal differences/differing opinions he felt that effort put into things like the BSG clan league and nation wars/gview tournament were overlooked or ignored while he was trying to attone for earlier infractions.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:	Anyone will be lucky to have you as a friend Rossi.
	TAhackdZ:	Well said mate. +1

[Xeen]

ALRIGHT SINCE IM LEAVING IM WEIGHING IN HERE

What are you idiots doing?

Originally Posted by Nirvana

lol @ del trying to put down any event he is not a part off. This is a fun event I'm taking the time to organise for the community. Stop viewing us a threat, we aren't going to take away your "importance" or the tournaments you organise.

Why are you taking a cheap shot at deL here? What is the purpose? You're an admin, act professionally - if you feel deL's being overly dickish, infract him and formally send him a PM 'don't be a dick', don't turn it into some deL vs 'the community' thing. If you want to give a personal opinion, don't infract - either you moderate and stay out of it, or you step down from your post and don't, otherwise it's conflicting interest. This is internet moderation 101.

Either way you should have just PM'd him to hush if you felt it was over the line, or simply infracted and stayed out of it. Infractions/rep system do not exist to get the last word in, and this is not your argument anyways. I'm not surprised deL flipped out on you because this is unacceptable.

Originally Posted by Nirvana

People are free to express their opinions about the lineups

So how does this fit with the deL thing? He was expressing an opinion, whether fully informed or not. Opinions means you can also say negative things, but you then slammed down a trumped-up personal attack on him. Classy.

By the way, deL isn't trolling, because that has a very specific definition. He's not trying to get a rise out of people by baiting them, he's expressing his own view.

Originally Posted by Nirvana

Its supposed to be a fun tournament and celebration but its already tainted by del in the very first post as you can see.

No Nirvana, it was tainted when you turned it into a you vs deL argument because you took a comment, moderated it, and then went in swinging to make it a personal battle. You could have deleted the post, ignored it altogether and let the rep system handle it (you know, that system that lets users perform minor moderation that you specifically put through), or infracted it and left an impartial message, or even just PM'd him to cheer up.

Originally Posted by Nirvana

So I temp banned him for that rant and in "retaliation" he instantly abandoned the BSGCL with the reason being "blame nirvana", even going as far to delete the OP which contained all the vital information for the BSG teams (this was restored).

Ok hang on. deL, what are you doing? This is what people like IdrA and NeverGG do to spite people, being petty as hell and directly hurting the community to try to get back at someone. Both of them ended up banned and damned sure deserved it.

Originally Posted by Nirvana

He already lost all the trust from the community by suddenly abandoning the BSGCL in anger.

What? The community? Did the community ask to remove him from Team Australia? Are you in charge of Team Australia? What gives you the authority to make these decisions? I'm just seeing you lash out and worsen a situation to get the last hit in for no good reason. If this was as serious as you make it, you wouldn't have to remove him from his position (a position, I might add, that doesn't answer to you), because there would be pressure from the team itself.

Both of you acted embarrassingly for your positions. I have sympathy for deL in this situation, but when you call someone out, it's better to make it mannered, because your purpose isn't to injure the recipient, but expose them to the community and garner support. You've been a part of the SC community for years, you should know how to act in the internet. Nirvana... goddamnit. Moderators don't get to inflict their personal opinions on people when performing professional roles, for the same reason policemen don't get to brawl with people they're angry with. You stay detached from that and handle it with the purpose of facilitation and pacification, not fightin' and ignitin'.

And most importantly, this entire thread should not exist. All it does is diminish public opinion of all involved, and this isn't a forum issue - it's a personal issue between the two of you that should be settled privately and not via moderation.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:	This was great feedback, thanks for sharing.
	TAScarecrow:	Great post, hopefully both sides learn from this
	TAriiChard:	What Scarecrow said. Lets make love

[nirvAnA]

Updated OP with chronological order.

Thanks for your comments xeen, I actually infracted him with the standard default infraction, then left a reputation remark. So its two separate systems but i can see how it gets mixed up and you're right if i infracted him i should not have negative reputationed him as well as moderators always stay out of it. Yes I was definitely at fault too. It was mostly because i have told him sooo many times in the past through PMs or on msn/skype about his behaviour not once, not 5 times but easily over 20 times. He has been banned by other moderators at least 3 times, this is not new behaviour hes just not changing - look at his 3 pages of infraction history. http://www.sc2sea.com/member.php?u=2...=3#infractions Yet he still continues this behaviour, so i was very frustrated and that resulted in me telling him to grow up. Yes as a mod i should have stayed out of it.

As for Nation Wars authority im the only other admin apart from jump. I was the reason why season 1 was a success and even happened in the first place and apart from jump the reason why season 2 is happening. I require good communication lines with all team managers. I cant trust him to not let his anger effect the event be it refusal to send replays, not preparing the team, or making the communication difficult which is not hard to believe for him to do in spite since hes mad at me. We have an obligation to the sponsor to eliminate any potential risks from the tournament. basically if he didnt cancel the BSGCL in retaliation which was totally unrelated he would still be manager (even after that personal attack, im forgiving like that) but the cancellation has shown this unstable side of him.

Yes i agree i should stay out of it, and be the quiet admin in the back. ziE told me about this too, i should be acting like an admin when im currently not, im letting my personal values and opinions get involved. So im sorry zie and xeen. I shall try my best to remain not as a public figure as this only harms my reputation.

[AZKziek]

I'm not a big fan of deL and I think it's good his reign has finally come to an end (He got away with way too much, I'm glad he's no longer here, a step forward for sure).
EDIT: Now that his position has been flushed away, what does it take for one to take his place?

[Nemo]

I didn't want to get involved in this since I don't know the history before those events.

Originally Posted by TAdeL

I'll be sure to suck your tiny asian dick every time you so much as fart on this site next time.

But this is something that made me jump of my chair. It's racism ! Judging or insulting someone on its race it's plainly disgusting.

That could be said on a such multi-ethnic community and that nobody react is beyond my understanding.

Del, racism has done so much evil, suffering and death in this world, even recently, how can you speak about helping build South East Asia community and say such things.

For his friends, there is a time when you must tell (privately) the truth to your friend and tell him how degrading such ideas and speech are, whatever the circumstances. Stress and anger absolutly don't excuse that, it just shows our deep ideas. That time has come now (if you didn't already have).

Del, know that whatever they say or they don't say, every Asian person that has read your sentence will think about it each time they see you. Facing racism agaisnt you is something you usually don't speak about but that you never forget.

I strongly advice you to publicly apology to nirvAnA for that sentence and admit racism is a plague to reject.

The rest is nothing compared to this.

Originally Posted by Xeen

And most importantly, this entire thread should not exist. All it does is diminish public opinion of all involved, and this isn't a forum issue - it's a personal issue between the two of you that should be settled privately and not via moderation.

The whole truth should be said since there was several impacts concerning other people (cancel of tournament, etc.).

Quick Comments

TAriiChard:

What del's racism was spare the moment and from what I remember, he told me that he was regretful straight away. Plus he uncancelled the tournament within hours.

[|Erasmus|]

I just want to respond to Rossi and say that, since I met deL in person and seeing the way he was actually being involved in the community with the BSGCL thing...

Before that, I'd only interacted with him through this site, and honestly, he comes across as a troll and a bit of a dickhead. It's not surprising that he'd get himself infracted for just making stupid and unnecessary comments. Feedback is mostly welcome (both positive and negative) but it needs to be given in a certain way, and usually read the OP of something before giving feedback.

If deL just accepted his infraction, no harm done, just try a tiny bit harder when posting in future... Instead he cancels the one big community thing he's been doing, and tries to sabotage it so noone can continue to run it without him. That doesn't strike me as the guy a lot of you people claim has selflessly done so much for australian starcraft, just a petty guy who wants more recognition and doesn't want any one else to have a share in it.

And since i'm on it, I'll also say that the cliquish way that TA often carries on on this site can be a little off putting to outsiders. Any negative post about any one of you guys often ends up with a lot of bad rep... A lot of the time we don't interact with you guys off this site, so don't expect us to know deL's personality (or any other TA member's) and get that any comment is supposed to be a joke, or that it's just how someone is.

Quick Comments

	NvRossi:	I cant put into words how stupid this post makes you sound.
	nirvAnA:	You just proved his point lol

[Nvdeth]

You criticise del for a post thats clearly out of line, make personal attacks on him and his integrity, then after things escalate you write a 1400 word post posing as a impartial, trustworthy summary which is in fact just a highly biased long winded excuse to put del and everything hes done for the community down again.

You should be ashamed of yourself.

Quick Comments

nirvAnA:

expected nothing less from you. compare dels post and mine and tell me which is the personal attack

[TAScarecrow]

Originally Posted by |Erasmus|

If deL just accepted his infraction, no harm done, just try a tiny bit harder when posting in future... Instead he cancels the one big community thing he's been doing, and tries to sabotage it so noone can continue to run it without him. That doesn't strike me as the guy a lot of you people claim has selflessly done so much for australian starcraft, just a petty guy who wants more recognition and doesn't want any one else to have a share in it.

And since i'm on it, I'll also say that the cliquish way that TA often carries on on this site can be a little off putting to outsiders. Any negative post about any one of you guys often ends up with a lot of bad rep... A lot of the time we don't interact with you guys off this site, so don't expect us to know deL's personality (or any other TA member's) and get that any comment is supposed to be a joke, or that it's just how someone is.

To be fair it was the snide remark about deL's "importance" that really set him off imo. If it was just a straight up infraction this wouldn't have happened. I'd be pretty upset if a mod warned me for a post whilst mocking what I invest so much time and energy in (and in deL's case he's damn good at it).

I can't defend his response and appreciate Nirvana actually putting that paragraph out in the open to back up the ban (which was thoroughly deserved). Everyone can have a shitty day and do/say something rash. It happens. Just don't disregard all the work and good he has done for SC in our region. The guy works his arse off creating quality events, there's a reason FXO hired him. He deserves a second chance and to say the whole community has lost trust in him is plain wrong. I still trust him and I know many on TL and TA feel the same.

The community as a whole can't be spoken for (hence forums), yes TA is a tight-knit bunch and I won't apologize for that. In a clan of our size it's easy to create a perception based on our most vocal/bm members. We're really just a cross-section of SC enthusiasts and I'm proud of how the majority of our 80+ members conduct themselves.

Quick Comments

	nirvAnA:	I should not mix up moderation with my personal comments. I 100% agree that was wrong of me.
	Maynarde:	Very well put, +1 respect for maturity and facts.
	nGenLight:	This guy is seriously awesome.